David Singer,

Of course most comments here might appear OT, however you're not really writing stand alone articles on different subjects, are you? Your latest effort is just another in a very long series of Zionist propaganda.

So I'm sure you'll understand if, I and others, don't bother to distinguish one from another.

If "Jordan is Palestine", then "New York, Melbourne and London are all Israel".

Yuyutsu,

Yes, I've given much the same wiki-history lesson to ignorant Moslems.

Tp csteele

Shooting the messenger and ignoring the message is really a waste of time.

I could give you an equally demeaning resume on Abbas,Arafat and Haniyeh - but it proves nothing. What counts is what comes out of their mouths. This needs to be analysed and interpreted.

That is what I have tried to do.

If you don't agree - then tell me what you think his statement means and where you differ from my view.

Dear Benbec,

You are right, a more constructive response is in order. Engaging with David Singer's articles has served to kick that habit from me a little more than I would care to admit.

One of the saving graces of Israel is its legal system. It often holds against the corruption and sins of the Israeli government and provides some hope for the future. What concerns me most is whether the changing demographics placing more power in the hands of the ultra religious will end up subsuming it.

The High Court's outlawing of the use of human shields in spite of vigorous protests by the military was heartening. So too was the outlawing in 1999 of torture in most circumstances.

Only a few months ago the High Court ruled that an Arab Israeli couple were able to build on a plot of public land within a Jewish neighbourhood. It had taken numerous appeals and six years of fighting to force a reversal of the apartheid stance of the officials concerned.

The town's committee had determined Ahmed Zabeidat "lacked interpersonal sophistication and has difficulty integrating naturally into society," and his wife, Fatina too individualistic.

http://www.haaretz.com/print-edition/news/israel-s-high-court-orders-jewish-galilee-town-to-accept-arab-couple-1.384296

Even the Military justice system has kicked the traces. Just last month, in an unheard of act, a military court partially acquitted a Palestinian due to what it recognised as a forced confession. However the chances of this becoming more common is remote under a system where of the 9,500 files dealt with in 2010 only 82 end in trials as virtually all cases instead end in plea bargains. Hats off to Lt. Col. Zvi Lekach.

http://www.btselem.org/torture/20111213_hamidah_verdict

Kudos too to the above Israeli Human Rights organisation. They are tireless and inspiring and answer the need for some of us to see a living example of the strong advocacy for justice that has helped define the Jewish contribution to the world.

It is such a pity that the Israeli government does not appear to respect and cherish it as it should.

Dear David,

You were the one claiming “Republican front runner for next President of the United States - Newt Gingrich - has done himself and his campaign great credit in branding the Palestinians as an invented nation.”.

Firstly he is no longer the front runner and secondly there is nothing creditable about him.

If you don't want your messenger shot don't send a goose.

Further “Gingrich's message to the PLO is clear “, it is not “return to the negotiating table and hammer out a deal with Israel” it is go and raise enough money to buy your own politician.

That you have resorted to extolling the opinion of such a corrupt and discredited politician to support your position speaks volumes about its merits.

I have explained earlier that I am loathed to rehash old arguments as to why you are so wrong on this issue, but I tell you what. If you can come up with a notable figure, one that is recognised as having at least a measure of integrity, who holds the same position as yourself and Newt, I will do as you request. Otherwise please enjoy each other's company.

http://www.btselem.org

The late Vaclav Havel.

#Mac

Jordan is Palestine according to article 2 of the PLO Covenant:

"Palestine, with the boundaries it had during the British Mandate, is an indivisible territorial unit."

The Mandate covered what is today called Israel, the West Bank, Gaza and Jordan.

Jordan's late Kings - Abdullah and Hussein - and the PLO's late leader Yasser Arafat also agreed - as did a lot of other Arab leaders.

What particular expertise do you possess to pooh pooh what the PLO Charter expressly says?

#csteele

Gingrich was saying nothing more than PLO spokesman Zuhair Mohsen who told the Dutch newspaper Trouw way back in 1977:

"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct Palestinian people to oppose Zionism. For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."

Got any dirt to drop on Mohsen or those who passed a resolution at the 8th PNC meeting in 1971 that said the same thing?

Failing to accept 95% of its demands seems to me to be suicidal for the PLO. It is going to miss the train once again - as has happened so often to the Palestinian Arabs during the last 90 years.

Gingrich has warned the PLO not to expect American support in holding out for 100% of its current demands if Gingrich becomes President. He has clearly signalled in his statement that his policy will be very different to Obama's.

Who are you suggesting raised enough money to buy Obama's policy?