proud to indonesian, sorry we dont do electric shock thingy, we have become a little more humane, but like I said before it takes cooperation to get over hurdles like this, we are willing to help, more than likley we will pay to help you, we have the expertise in this equipment, if only cooperation was enlisted, you would find that the cattle are easier to handle easier to kill and all according to halal with the benefit of better tasting meat, we were no different in the way we killed animals not so long ago but we learnt.
It seems to me with your replies that humane killing of animals is something your not interested in, is this correct?

Wow, PtbI! Are you capable of placing your hands on your keyboard without pouring forth a stream of vitriol?

You presented a statistic that appears to have been plucked from thin air. I presented a series of statistics, backed with sources, that contradict your statement. From this, you can determine:

1) that I don't care about Australian farmers. A rather absurd assertion, especially as I concede that the suspension of live trade was "a knee jerk reaction and a poor one".

2) that I would rather see thousands of Australians bankrupted than miss an opportunity to act like an old-time colonial power interfering in other countries' internal affairs. Again, an absurd assertion, given the above.

I'm not convinced that this will destroy our cattle industry, either, as the dollars simply don't add up. You, as a perennial critic of all things Australian, should be well aware that we can be quite over-the-top with our doom and gloom. It will place hardship on our industry, and it will result in the loss of some jobs. It may also result in the closure of some businesses. For those reasons, again, I don't think it's a great decision.

As for the suggestion that I'd much rather act like a colonial power and interfere in other nations' affairs, well, there is hard proof on this forum that you have no idea what you're talking about. In the past, I have:

1) argued that we should butt out of Indonesia's legal system, and allow Indonesians to impose the penalties they believe are appropriate for our criminals detained there.

2) argued against assertions by fellow posters and other Australians that the Indonesian court system is corrupt and that Australians can't get a fair trial there.

3) argued that we need to accept that the values of our neighbouring countries differ from our own.

It seems that your capacity to smear my character is matched only by your capacity to construct a statistical argument. Both need work.

Proud To Be Indonesian is correct in one respect. Apparently Indonesian newspapers have barely mentioned the ban in live cattle exports to Indonesia.

However, not correct in “Indonesians will just find someone else who can trade on a goodwill basis, rather than being exposed to uncertainty and arbitrariness of trading with Australia”

If Indonesia or any country has a trading partner, and is unwilling to listen to the concerns of that trading partner, then eventually there are fewer trading partners left to deal with, either for imports or exports.

Having seen the videos of the slaughtering, it would appear cruel to the animal and also unsafe for the workers involved. Having a bullock running around inside a building with its throat half cut would be very unsafe for any nearby workers, and also cruel for the bullock.

I think that abattoirs (wherever it is) should have something better for the cattle and for the workers involved.

Let's hope Proud to be Indonesian is not typical of his/her compatriots. Nowhere in his/her comments is the slightest indication of concern for the welfare of the livestock. If that sort of attitude is at all prevalent in Indonesia, then it is incumbent upon the Australian end of the trade to take responsibility for ensuring animal welfare standards are met, otherwise no deal.

As Otokonoko points out, live exports to Indonesia are not critical to the beef industry in Australia overall. While a permanent ban would create hardship in the short term for the relatively small number of producers who depend on the live export trade, the industry will adapt. Twenty years ago there was no live export trade to Indonesia, but we had a thriving cattle industry, complete with abattoirs in the north.

We survived without live exports and will do so again. If Indonesia wants to buy our beef on the hoof, they have to guarantee that cattle will be humanely slaughtered, otherwise no live exports can be permitted to Indonesia.

Well put Otokonoko and morganzola.

If the issue has been nothing but a ripple in the Indonesian media what is all the fuss about.

While I can see a natural temptation to trot out the racist card on any issue of contention, it does not mitigate the fact that some countries have their own beliefs about treatment of animals and the manner in which they are slaughtered.

If religious ritual demand that an animal die in a particular way (as some sort of sacrifice for humans), other cultures and people also possess the right to disagree. Countries make decisions and judgements based on their own cultural standards. Why would you consider Indonesian culture and values any more superior than Australian (or any other).

Humane slaughter is part of Islamic Law as outlined in this speech:

http://www.beefcentral.com/p/news/article/156

Maybe it is time that 'religious law' is over-ruled by animal welfare laws?
Many old, ancient religious practices of many different religions have had to change over the years in order to keep up with the times, and with the increasing knowledge and humanity of human beings.

Why must we continue to allow the treatment of cattle or other animals to go unchecked simply because they have 'always been killed that way' in some religions?

We can't stop what other countries do to their animals, but we can refuse to send our animals to those countries.

I totally support the banning of live exports.