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The Forum > Article Comments > Live animal export and knee-jerk reactions > Comments

Live animal export and knee-jerk reactions : Comments

By Brian Holden, published 11/6/2011

If we cut animals they certainly bleed, but do they feel as we do and whose pain should we feel first?

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"To suffer an animal must have a sense of identity."

What a complete load of crap. You simply have no idea of what you are talking about.

You are trying to make an argument against providing animals for cruel slaughter by first claiming that animals do not feel pain, only us 'special' human animals can. Then you try an explain the treatment of these animals by stating that indonesians have a low standard of living. This is irrelevant, and like all your arguments do not stand up to 1 minute of scrutiny.

Perhaps you should have focused on the actual problems/solutions with the cruel methods of animal slaughter and the resulting ban.
Posted by Stezza, Saturday, 11 June 2011 4:12:00 PM
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''Live exports to Indonesia account for about one-fifth of all the Southeast Asian nation's rising beef consumption.

Jakarta is not yet satisfied that the video showing brutal abuse of Australian cattle in Indonesian slaughterhouses is authentic but has promised to intensify welfare programmes and says it has to "respect" the ban.''

It is not the government who will go hungry, theirs or ours. Cattle are bred for meat, no matter how you look at the Slaughter they do feel pain, I do not dispute that, but as the writer says, millions of people, mainly children are under nourished & are weakned then die. There will be many Indonesian workers directly employed to move the cattle from the boats, to the Slaughterhouses, and the Abottors workers will not be compensated, nor find work overnight, nor do they get Welfare as there is none. Just how do you expect their children to eat with no money coming into the family?
Posted by bluffitpam, Saturday, 11 June 2011 5:59:54 PM
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So by the authors argument if a human was subject to physical assault they would only feel pain because they feel like a victim and not the actualy physical assault. I do not understand the authors argument that an animal cannot feel pain because it doesnt have the sense of the victim. what about the pain induced by having its throat slit while its concious?
Posted by Gurteaj, Saturday, 11 June 2011 6:00:42 PM
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If we cut animals they certainly bleed, but do they feel as we do and whose pain should we feel first?
Say those who are fussy about their meat in yuppy restaurants.
Posted by individual, Saturday, 11 June 2011 9:06:41 PM
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This knee-jerk suspension of animal exports are typical Australian hubris resulting from exaggerated sense of racial superiority over Indonesians. Some Australians think they somehow has the "leverage" to command Indonesians on what to do with Indonesian internal affairs.

The fact is, the only people who will get hurt by this suspension are Australian farmers, as Indonesia buy 70% of their cattle. I suppose those Australians who advocated this banning are very pleased about the thought of bankrupting hundreds of Australian businesses and sending thousands of Australians into unemployment. There are no other major market for Australian beef so close and so large as Indonesia.

On the other hand, Indonesia sourced 70% of its beef needs domestically. The remaining 30% are imported, around 2/3 of the imports are from Australia. There has been growing calls for the past years from Indonesian cattlers to stop imports from overseas (including Australia) which has been depressing beef prices.

Consequently, the result of this suspension on Indonesia is minimum, as we have enough cattle stock for three months. In that period, we can easily sourced imported beef from elsewhere (India, China, USA, South America) to cover for supply shortfall. Additionally, do not expect any Indonesian importers to take the risk of buying cattle from Australia anymore, even after the suspension is lifted.

In short, with regards to cattle, Australia needs Indonesia more than Indonesia needs Australia. Basically, Indonesians barely notice of this cattle issue as it has little impact on their daily lives.
Posted by Proud to be Indonesian, Saturday, 11 June 2011 9:23:42 PM
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...The worry of this event from the beginning, is the demonstration of manipulative power vested interest groups such as animal rights lobby in this case, but also the homosexual lobby, Global warming lobby, environmental pressure groups, and the host of other single interest groups wield over political direction of this Nation.

...It is not factual that cattle producers are insensitive to the suffering of the animals they produce on their farms: Cattle producers live work and often die themselves, in the same harshness of environment as do their stock. Theirs is not an easy lot, their life is a difficult one, a dangerous one and mostly an isolated one; the object of which is survival of themselves, their families and their workers, it’s that simple.

...The senseless stupidity of over-reaction by the Gillard Government in suspending all live stock trade with Indonesia without notice to producers, is evidence that this Government has “lost the plot” and has become insensitive to overriding issues of survival of the cattle producers, the human element in this equation.

...What Gillard unwittingly demonstrates by these actions, is her and her Governments dislocation from reality: That reality which should put as a priority, the welfare of people before all else: But instead puts as a presumption, Humans as wrong and animals as right. And that in a nut shell is the ethics of the Animal rights lobby, a sick and moronic group of self-interested “nutters”, captivated by constellating complexes, all too willing to override the dignity and welfare of honest and industrious cattle producers, to gain points for insipid oversensitivity of animal rights, at no real cost to themselves.

PS: Great article Brian

Dan.
Posted by diver dan, Saturday, 11 June 2011 9:34:11 PM
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