Hi George,

Thanks for the reply!

I’m glad too that you considered what I had to say, and your response proved challenging.

It just goes to show how open-minded you are and how willing you are to consider other points-of-view that actually challenge your position rather than kissing up to you. Most Christians would just shut-off in that situation and stick to what was comfortable, but not you.

I look forward to more fruitful discussions in the future.

See ya!

Oh dear Danny,

Still not studied much. Did you get help in your ignorance? or is it a purely personal achievement? It seems you get your advice from the same religious sources as many of the routinely ignorant. Catch up, won't you? An adult conversation would be possible if you deserved one. Christ taught humility but not to fundies.

We *could* list the many mutations that do not have any effect on human health, coding for the same amino acid residue 'n all. We could also list the many mutations that change one amino-acid for another with little change in either the specificity or activity of the protein product. Such are the basis of genetic drift, something else you might look up in the copious free time otherwise be devoted to ancient fiction.

We could *also* list the many new metabolic capacities of bacteria to deal with entirely novel antibiotics not previously seen in nature. *critical* to human health they are. Don't tell any fundies, but they *evolved* this capacity. Since bacterial disease is still one of the biggest killers, It is my opinion that fundies should sign documents stating they understand that evolution is real before recieving antibiotics.

Lets look a little further:
Lenski isolated several sample populations of bacteria and subjected these to intermittent sparing conditions.

*some* populations displayed *common* mutations that enhanced efficiency in sparing conditions.
*other* isolated populations displayed rarer mutations (a) and (b) of a particular gene that in the correct order enabled an ultimately more enabling metabolic capacity not displayed in either the parent culture nor often in parallel cultures.

This is a not uncommon exercise for undergrads.

Technicians using the Ames assay do not assay the *loss* but the *regaining* of metabolic capacity in specifically disabled cells.

At a fundamental level, mutation explores options and advances better ones, in the presence of selection.

Any undergrad text in microbial genetics can help fill the deficiencies in your understanding that reliously-inspired selective reading has encumbered you with.

Anytime Evolution does not inform medicine, I'm leaving, and you will die of a nasty disease.

Rusty

oliver/quote,,<<..The learner>>>clearly....is doing/a thing/act..first-time...

but/then goes-on-to/...a second/time...and in/with/via hindsight..does better..[go-fiure-eh?]

<<does-not/a priori..know fact/from fiction..>>>via..previous/experience...ie..that done/before..prior[e]

<<and..therefore/does>>>..you got-it..right..first-time

those..who/do-NOT..see/truth..is via..miraclous enlightenment....even if/it was/..all within..are missing..the learning/gained...from the first-time

<<Atheism/is..a result..of God's/non..involvement>>>..by him obeying..their/deliberate-chosing*/..not*-to..know...

[if a fragile/phycie...cannot face..a concept/..then god will/in no way force..them..to see..the bleeding/obvious...in time theyALL..come arround...and seek-to know/him..

gods way/is sure...letting us/..chose when..we/are ready

like/the slave-boy,..we are ignorant...because we..chose*..not/to know

<<(of knowledge),..unless/God intervene's..>>>..and/god has learned..'interventions'...dont-work.

where God/interveneD..and enlightens,..it-is NOT/God's hand's-on involvement,..for this..he has intermediaries...

[even if by/large..they-are..mostly..self-appointed...and..as/long as their/intervention..is benevolent*...all would/be fine

but when/its..adverse*..[to the individual/freewill*/..act]..strict laws of karmic/balance..is earned

[one/of..the worst-crimes..BALANCED..in the life/herafter..is deliberatly/decieving..others..away-from..the all loving../all living good..of grace/mercy]

there are/many sanctimonious-fools..in hell..there..simply/because they turned/gods love..into vile...

deliberatly missled/decieved..gods-own..[or put temptations/puzzels..where/god desires..only truth/love]

God it/self..lol..has made..the knowledge/know-ABLE/..seek-find..objectively/via his creation..or subjectivly..via faith.

God makes/the being..their verifications..DEEDS/works..create/faith

it cannot/will-not..be-known..to an elect/ALONE..as we/may know him...one-to-one..to suit the purpose/of God..as heart/the active/..thiest/the mind...become-one..'at-one-ment'

posssession/of knowledge/..of the self-organising universe/would be..God's gift/of illusery-knowledge..that/limits the comprehension of the Atheist..to the..immanent realm,..EAR_THHH..

this realm/..EAR-TH/..to keep the heavens/pure/safe/mercyfull..by the order/of God./good/love/grace..

thus/we live/here..in satans realm...till*..we chose*..the light/love/logic/life..or..CHOSE/to..reject the light..and dwell in the dark/realms

The naive/fundamentalist..finds Good,[its as simple as loving/doing/good..to other

the Atheis/ manipulates knowledge...claims/science ..then proceeds to lead gods-own..away from the/..all living/loving,light/logic..by graphs/drawings/missing links...

IE..un-validatable/unverifyable/claim...not-to mention;..a science/priest-hood..of peers..who revieuw/edit..the di-versive vision..of chance/survival..of fittest/fat-test

<<and the/so called..sophisticated/Atheist,>>becomes..adept/at self deceptuion/never demanding proof..nor/thus..being able to replicate..the theory..

nor explain/in simple-words..what came first..
or what evolved/from what...as verifyable*..science/fact

then..we have/the decieved/..thiest..science with God added....
for those unable-to..take sides..[or too/ignorant..to question the science/..claim...'C'-lame

>>Herein,..Kierkegaard>>..[translation..'church-guard']..<<would have all the players puppets,...without/free will.>>>

and subjected/to..the will of/either..the church/peer's..

or the science/peers..

but/mostly..via-not/knowing..
the personal/living loving good..
without first..seeking out..an intermediatory/..mess--iah...to ex-plain..it to/for..or through them

ohh ahhh-men

Our relationship/with God
is determined by our will/desire..
to know/do..the good of God.

then/like god..serve the good/..bad alike

GREAT/we finally/god a rusty/catharsis..to quote..<<We..*could*..list/the many mutations..that do not have any effect on human health,>>>yet many/mutation..DO..

BECAUSE MUTATIONS..occure..within the same genus/sure they can transmit/between..species/within the same genus/family...occasionally...THUS

<<..coding/for the same amino-acid residue..'n all.../that change/one amino-acid..for another..with little change in either>>yes a great sign..for LIKELY/interelated-ness

VIA..<<the specificity or activity of the protein>>ingrediants/constituating parts..dna/rna..codings...but not the<<product.>>

AS the constituant parts determing the..'product'..<<are the basis/of..DETERMINING..genetic drift,>>that may establish..genetic likages..or LIKELY/relatedness..of hosts

BUT<<..list the many/new metabolic capacities..of bacteria>>..<<not previously seen in nature.>>and you reveal...ITS ALL WITHIN THE GENUS...of their/own specific family

<<they..*evolved*..this capacity.>>WITHIN THEIR OWN GENUS/family..even only within their own species/even though occasionally..they might be residing in divergent/hosts

<<Since bacterial/disease..is still one of the biggest-killers,>>>isnt it time to reveakl how the single-cell/bateria..became a multi-cell..HOST..!

<<It is my opinion/that fundies..should sign documents/stating..they understand that evolution is real/before recieving antibiotics.>>

it is my opinion/..that science claims..should be replicatable...OUT OF SPECIES..before those seeking to deney/..hypocritic oaths..make/claims to serve only ATHIESTS..BECAUSE they cant proove EVOLUTION..outside species..HAS NEVER BEEN RECORDED/../nor observed..nor done..in lab..or nature

<<Lenski isolated/several sample populations..of bacteria>>>LOL
<<and subjected these/to intermittent/sparing..conditions.>>the result...BACTERIA...lol

<<At a..fun-da/mental/level,..mutation explores options/and advances better ones,..in the presence..of/selection.>>and the result..IS ALLWAYS..the same genus that began...!


<<..Anytime/Evolution..does not inform medicine,..I'm leaving*
...,and you/will die..of a nasty disease.>>>..such a perfect egsample..of ego

no mate/most likely a diocter will DEEM my death/from smoking
despite MOST deaths/never getting an autopsy*

TALK ABOUT FANATICS
you certainly cant be a docter

maybe a wanna/be?

well

Rusty

you can shove ya

Rusty Catheter...
where the evolution/as evolved/your conditionally/mutative rectum
where the digetal inspection/pointer points...but i forgive you

please dont take this personally...

but is..that/the best EVIDENSE/YOU GOT?
what about/the fruit-flies...BILLIONS of experiments...

the result...STILL only..FRUIT-flies..!

what of/the UNCOUNTABLE...bacteria,...experiments..
done by you graduates*/wanna-be's

have you/EVER...found anything*..
evolved/OUT OF..BATERIUM...?

or even/a multi-celled bacterium..
that wasnt dividing..
or kept on dividing..conjoined?

no not one?
...ever?
gee wonder why...?

the genus/barrier holds firm

Dear OUG et al,

Kierkegaard I understand is an existentialist. He would feel that all we know of the ouside world comes to use through our unreliable senses and that our senses are fallible. Moreover, Kierkegaard would add he are born ignorant with those fallible senses, "unlike" Socrates and Meno (Plato). I think if Kierkegaard where to more fully the hard interpretation of posits to God, we can only be away of God, of god is real, through divine intervention. If divine intervention is infused, without the use of our fallible senses, direct inject appears to favour only the theistic. The comments about "puppets" were based Kierkegaard more own primary existentialist view of knowledge than his writings on God. If this isn true (an I am not saying it is), there are major issues for free will and why one is a theist or an atheist... God chooses.

As please be aware, if you have read Kierkegaard, he uses the word skeptic in a philosophical manner, which means, we should skeptical of our senses, because the external world is only known through those senses and reliability is no absolutely known. A strong-view existentialist would maintain to accurately know the outside world, with absolute confidence, is absurd. If knowledge of God is infalliable must have been selectively implanted in theists.

Again, I remind you that I think Kierkegaard the pulled-his-punches of his own theory when it came to God, wherein I am applying the gneral theory.

im still/peved..with the-rusty..cath-hater<<..It is my opinion/that fundies>>oops wrong one

<<you will die of a nasty disease.>>oops left out the reason..<<I'm leaving>>

ok its not/so bad..in hindsight
but here-is one..i prepared a little earlier

yeah...we got super-bugs/thats the problem with drug companies
sucking every last cent..out of the medicine subsidy/SCEME

heard last night on abc/many patients...
got an average of 17 medications
..the pill/popping/docters..put/em on

[NO DOUDT MANY SUBSIDISED...some costing/the people..taxpayers
thousands per unit...]

no doudt the docters/are getting their feed/back..bonus as well

also in the same/report it was reported...ADVERSE-reaction..to perscribed..medi-SIN..is the 4 th highest CAUSE of death...we have seen here/the atitude..of these god-heads..sign/this..lol..or no pills..!

noting the symptoms for the first 3..are the other causes/of death
so no doudt..there is an epidemic..

with these MULTINATIONAL/rip-off PERSCRIBED/drug-dealers
/dealing them..VIA DOCTERS PER-scriptions

anyhow/i hear that no disease can survive...HIGH body ph

reportedly..to up the ph..is as easy
as taking a tea-spoon of baking powder..
PUT SOME..IN YOUR NEXT batch...of.. bird/swine/human..FLUE MUTAGENE...lol[made in the labs..by pretend/docters..EVERY bit as vile as mengelar/in his natzi..death camp-studies

BUT..there are many/other..FREE_cures..WE DONT NEED/QUACKS..nor their drugs

such as harmonics/
that vibrates..the diseased cell..to extinction..

[it could even be broadcast on the radio/tv..aparently]..
but no doudt the PEERS/serving the legal drug cartel..would really hate that..poor them

but they/are just so blatent
about what..they are doping..

oops sorry doing

the funny thing/is
all they do..is name the SYMPTOM,,in latin
then look at the drug book..
to see what gives/them..their highest BONUS

do some research/on the doses/needed..to cure/ratio
thats how many..need TO/..TAKE..A GIVEN DRUG

TO GET ONE CURE...!

THE STROKE MEDICATION HAS A RATE OF/..50
[that need to take/medicine..to get..one cure]

then there is radio/harmonics/not eating..processed-food...sertyainly avoid their rusty needles/catheters...at least at macca's..the worst THEY could/do is spit..in ya burger

[not that they would]..but who/knows..
how far a rusty/a single-use..catheater..will go..
when they...*believe..they are infallable*/devine...

god incarnate/mate
or the nearest/the athiest could get near to..at any-rate

its mostly..placebo/affect

thats all..they*..gotta BEAT*
to get/on the..subsidised/..list..!

and get..Huge govt-welfare/checks..
hand-deliverd..by your/two party/machine-man..[local-member]