continued

Why do you continue to lie about the extend of the lands granted to the jewish people? They were never given the land beyond the green line in any way shape or form. It was, and still is inhabited by millions of Arabs who now see themselves as Palestinians. Are you saying that the United Nations was planning to implement ethnic cleansing in the West Bank? That they were going to remove every Arab or subject them to an Apartheid system for non Jews?

Why doesnt Israel just unilaterally declare all the land west of the Jordan Israeli territory and take the current inhabitants on a citizens? hmmm
We all know why. Israel would have an Arab majority and that would never do would it? That cant happen until the current inhabitants are removed, ethnically cleansed, genocided. Like they were in current Israel in 1948. Like Israel is doing with Gaza. Like the new racist deportation laws in the West Bank. Like the continued frantic and illegal settlement building. Once again Israels actions speak far louder than your words David.

"Judea and Samaria"
"500000 Jews live there" ....ILLEGALLY
Possession trumps your airy fairy stories from 3000 years ago.
Dispossession is a heinous crime against humanity and you Jews stand condemned for this crime.
I notice you studiously ignored my rant on the illegality of conquest. There's no answer is there Singer? Israel is in the wrong and must withdraw from all lands conquered in the wars since 1948.

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continued(finally...rotten post limits)

"2. Aboriginal rights were recognized by the Australian courts. Jewish rights in Palestine were recognized and granted by the League of Nations."
That is not an answer to the proposition I put forward. Do Aboriginals or Jews (or any other indigenous or previously dispossessed group) have the right to reclaim their ancestral homelands by force and dispossession of the current inhabitants?

"The Arabs have never accepted - nor stopped fighting - the League of Nations decision and the decisions of the United Nations."
I thought you said support for Israel was unanimous? hmmm Theres something faulty in your logic.

Bloody oath I object to Jordan being an Islamic theocracy. And a monarchy. Damn parasitic royals. Same for Saudi, the abu dubai emirates places, Iran, The Taliban they are all religious nutters who should be locked up in strait jackets Israel included. You're all backward morons who use your god/s as a weapon and mouth sweet platitudes and prayers while dismembering the corpse of secular society and all the progress that has come about as a result of the church being banished from the functions of state in all modern, democratic, successful states.

I note you didnt answer my question of whether you recognise these countries as religious states the way you want them to recognise Israel?

Withdraw means get out and leave the people alone. Not get out and imprison and besiege the population then wage war on them with missiles and bombs and white phosphorous like Israel has done to Gaza. No wonder they fire rockets at you. You control who can come and go and what essential supplies are (not) allowed in. Hardly a withdrawal.

You know damn well there is much debate about the precise meaning of UN res 242. Israel and its allies worked very hard to undermine the meaning with their weasel words. It is still irrelevant as I noted (and you ignored) yesterday since international law prohibits the keeping of conquered territory by anyone. Therefore Israel must withdraw from the land conquered since 1948. What is it that you dont understand?

Mikk, I admire your tenacity in trying to argue with David S. but you must keep in mind that he can only understand what his narrow religious conviction tells him.

That is why religion is so dangerous. It substitutes belief (also known as wishful thinking) for rationality and reality.

# David G

1. You state:

"Perhaps Israel could be re-located in America or in Jordan and the Palestinians, those that have survived the Jewish oppression and brutality, allowed to resume their shattered lives."

At least you are now trying to put forward a solution to end the
conflict.

However why should any Jews - or Arabs - have to be relocated from their existing homes into Jordan or America?

Under my proposal to divide the West Bank between Jordan and Israel - no-one - Jew or Arab - has to leave his current home or business.

Under my proposal the Arab population of the West Bank will be allowed "to resume their shattered lives" as citizens of an Arab state free of Israeli control.

Nevertheless you should do what I am doing - push your proposal to try and gain its acceptance to end the current impasse. You never know - perhaps there will be a lot of support for your idea.

At least your are using your time and intellect to try and resolve - not perpetuate - the conflict.

2. Your support for mikk only serves to confirm you have the same totally blinkered approach he has.

In ignoring the crucial importance of international law encapsulated in the San Remo conference, the Treaty of Sevres, the Mandates for Palestine, Syria and Mesopotamia, article 80 of the United Nations Charter and Security Council Resolution 242 - you display a total inability to want to comprehend or understand the reasons for the current conflict and the way forward to resolve it.

Of course you can reject this body of international law - as the Arabs have done - and are entitled to do if they want to.

But rejection has come at a terrible price in human pain and suffering for both Arabs and Jews. This is destined to continue until they accept what the international community agreed on in 1920.

David S, you say: but rejection has come at a terrible price in human pain and suffering for both Arabs and Jews.

I have watched the conflict in the West Bank and Gaza for a decade and I have noted that the pain and suffering is felt mainly (95%) by the Palestinians.

Are you familiar with the blog called Desert Peace? It's run by an American Jew. It tells the story of the Israeli occupation from an Arab perspective. You really should pay it a visit, get a bit of reality into your mind for a change, see how poorly and inhumanely the Palestinians are treated by God's Children.

http://desertpeace.wordpress.com/

# To mikk

1 The international community in 1922 went back to the Bible when they unanimously declared in the League of Nations Mandate document:

"Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country"

You are right - the Arabs never accepted this declaration by the 51 members of the League of Nations. They were not members of the League of Nations. They had been given 99.999% of the defeated Ottoman Empire with the approval of the League of Nations but obviously they wanted - and still want 100%.

I repeat this was 1922 - not 1948. Something you don't want to know about. Well I suggest you study the period of 1919 - 1922 and then come back and tell me what you think.

2. You state:

"Why do you continue to lie about the extend of the lands granted to the jewish people? They were never given the land beyond the green line in any way shape or form."

Sorry mikk - they were given the right to settle in the West Bank and Gaza under article 6 of the Mandate and article 80 of the UN Charter.
They were kicked out of there in 1948. Their legal right to settle in the West Bank and Gaza is preserved under this existing international law.

3. You state:

"international law prohibits the keeping of conquered territory by anyone."

So according to your interpretation of international law - the entire Ottoman Empire (including Palestine) should have been returned to Turkey after its defeat in World War 1

Sorry - like so much of your rants - your take on international law is wrong.

The rest of your posts do not merit a reply.