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The simple overriding fact is a prohibition in international law against any country expanding their territory through conquest.
It is illegal.
No one can do it.
The Americans were not allowed to "own", permanently control, nor take resources from Iraq after they conquered it. Indonesia was forced to allow East Timor independence despite it being a tiny enclave deep within Indonesia. The British, French, Portuguese, Dutch, Germans and Spanish all had to give up their colonies.
Israel cannot keep the lands it conquered in the six day war for this reason and must withdraw. It is up to Israel as the stronger power and the occupier to take the first steps and withdraw. This is what should have been done many years ago and is the only way this conflict will begin to be solved.

What is so bad anyway? Israel is doing pretty well. It would not effect your prosperity nor your ability to function if you withdrew so why not. Especially in exchange for a long awaited and (so you say) long wished for peace. If Israel withdrew to 1967 lines how much land would you actually lose 2%? 5%? Hardly enough to even slightly diminish any part of Israeli society. It would not damage your economy indeed I think a cessation of war would be a huge boost for the Israeli economy, and the rest of the region. People in the settlements, which are after all illegal in the eyes of the international community, could be offered the option of selling up and moving into Israel proper or staying put and becoming citizens of the new Palestine with all the same rights and obligations as the Arab citizens. The same as Arab citizens in Israel.
This is not my idea but I support it as does the majority of the world according to numerous votes in the united nations and elsewhere.
Most of all this is the just solution. the only just solution. And it does not hurt Israel Indeed it will help Israel become more prosperous, safer and accepted by the international community

# To David G

I am glad that you do not want to get rid of the Jewish people.

You just want them to "act in responsible, compassionate manner, see themselves as normal human beings like the rest of us".

What if they don't heed your advice?

You must have some solution in mind to avert the world end you forecast if the Jews don't meet your prescribed standards.

As you stated - "To see the world end because of the imperial ambitions of a tiny group of religious fanatics (1% of the world's population) is ridiculous."

What is your solution to preventing an end to the world if their imperial ambitions continue?

David S, I guess the world has only one option: it has to deal with Israel as it deals with any rogue nation which thinks it is above international laws and conventions that most nations abide by.

Just because a handful of people run around calling themselves 'The Children of God', that doesn't give them the right to trample all over other people and steal their land.

The creation of Israel has resulted in a dangerous flash-point, one that didn't exist before. Perhaps Israel could be re-located in America or in Jordan and the Palestinians, those that have survived the Jewish oppression and brutality, allowed to resume their shattered lives.

Cheers.

# mikk (Part 1)

I could go back to the beginning of time and rely on the biblical claim of the Jews to reclaim their ancestral land. Then people like you would denigrate the right of the Jews to return and claim their land after such a long time.

I have chosen the beginning of the 20th century (not 1948) because that is when the modern history of Palestine commenced.

That is the time that the international community unanimously recognized the claim in international law for the Jews to reconstitute their national home in their biblical and ancestral homeland. I don't need to go back to biblical times. The world did just that in the early 20th century and accepted the Jewish claim as being valid and justified.

That is why the international community agreed to award 99.999% of the Ottoman Empire to the Arabs for self determination and 0.001% to the Jews for self determination after the San Remo Conference was held, the Treaty of Sevres was signed and the Mandates for Palestine and Syria and Mesopotamia were granted by the League of Nations.

The boundaries of Palestine included what is today called Israel, the West Bank, Gaza and Jordan.

These are undeniable facts. They may be unpalatable to you and you can choose to ignore them - but I don't. Neither can anyone else who sincerely seeks to see an end to the current conflict.

# To mikk (Part 2)

1. Why should Jews use the terms "Judea and Samaria" instead of the "West Bank"?

Because 500000 Jews live there is one answer. They returned to live there after 1967 - in territory assigned for the Jewish people by the Mandate and the UN Charter - after having been kicked out by six invading Arab armies in 1948. Aren't they entitled to use the place names used exclusively for 3000 of the last 3060 years?

Jews maintain claims to sovereignty in Judea and Samaria under international law - so do the Arabs on the basis of possession. These competing claims have to be resolved in negotiations.

2. Aboriginal rights were recognized by the Australian courts. Jewish rights in Palestine were recognized and granted by the League of Nations.

3. Gosh mikk - you said the Saudi Plan contained the words "reconstitution of the Jewish National Home" - now admit it doesn't - and now say "nor should it".

Here is why it should.

The Arabs have never accepted - nor stopped fighting - the League of Nations decision and the decisions of the United Nations. Until they do the conflict will continue.

I repeat - the Arabs had their opportunity to end the conflict in 1937,1947, between 1948-1967, and between 1967-1993 when they finally came to the party. Negotiations since then have gone nowhere. Attributing blame for their failure does not help any resolution.

4. Do you object to Jordan being a religious state where Islam is the religion of the state, the Arabic language is its official language and Jews cannot own property?. In Israel - Hebrew and Arabic are the official languages and the widespread presence of mosques and churches attests to the freedom of worship. Yes Arabs can even own - and do own - land in Israel

5. Like so much of your diatribes - your comments about Resolution 242 are wrong. Go back and have another look.

6. Israel did withdraw - from Gaza in 2005. Its thank you present was thousands of rockets. It won't be repeating that mistake

"I could go back to the beginning of time and rely on the biblical claim of the Jews to reclaim their ancestral land."

You do! That is the base justification your people use to validate this sordid land grab.

"Then people like you would denigrate the right of the Jews to return and claim their land after such a long time."

Damn right I will. The lives of the living always take precedence over the dead. Your long dead ancestors lost this land and then moved on. The ancestors of the current inhabitants then moved in. The loss suffered by your long dead ancestors has absolutely no bearing on current living people. Facts on the ground as you Israelis are so fond of remain that the land belongs to current inhabitants not the ancestors of some long dispossessed tribe of godbotherers.

"the international community unanimously recognized"
Once again your bigotry and dishonesty shine through your weasel words. What about the Arabs? Unanimous my eye. Plenty of people did not agree with the formation of Israel hence why they had to unilaterally declare the state of Israel before the UN process was finished. And then have the gall to complain when their neighbors attack.

You dont seek an end to the conflict David. You seek the decimation and capitulation of your enemies. Israel's actions speak way way louder than your words.

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