Wow, KatieO, your life is certainly chock-full of fear and loathing, is it not.

>>Numerous examples in my thread of Islamisation (taqquia, denying a child the right to be raised by his mother, forcing Jewish people to take extreme measures to protect their children on Australian soil, denial of equal rights for man and woman, and the constant fear of perseuction), then there are the prayer rooms at UWS, and outside of this discussion halal food in my fridge, sharia finance being introduced at NAB, discussion of “sin industries” on Bloomberg News, the Catch the Fire Ministries’ trial<<

What a laundry-list of imagined wrongs! I'm amazed that you sleep at night.

Perhaps you don't; that would explain a lot.

For your information, this is Australia.

- we don't deny the right of a child to be raised by his mother. Almost the reverse is true, most courts practically insist upon it
- we don't force Jewish people
- we have equal rights for man and woman (perhaps not absolute equality, but close enough for this argument I think)
- no-one should be in “constant fear of persecution”, we have laws against that
- there is nothing illegal about prayer-rooms, of any denomination
- no-one is forcing you to keep halal food in your fridge
- no-one is forcing you to accept sharia finance from NAB
- and please, correct me if I am wrong, but didn't the law come down on the side of those bad-mouths at Catch-the-Fire?

I Googled “sin industries on Bloomberg News” but got no meaningful results.

I'll repeat my question, in case you misread it:

“Which Australian institutions and freedoms are being eroded by "Islam-creep"?

So far you have only managed to illustrate the precise opposite, that the administration of the law is as robust as ever.”

If you choose to spend your life in fear of your own shadow, so be it. But translating that fear into aggression against Islam is, as I have pointed out to Boaz on numerous occasions, simply destined to fan the flames of fear and distrust.

KatieO,

"taqquia, denying a child the right to be raised by his mother, forcing Jewish people to take extreme measures to protect their children..."

Just like the Jewish children taken by Christians, eh? The name Edgardo Mortara comes to mind (to name just one).

Pericles,

"translating that fear into aggression against Islam is, as I have pointed out to Boaz on numerous occasions, simply destined to fan the flames of fear and distrust."

Very wisely put.

CJ Morgan:
Makes a valid point, (some) Christian clergy abuse children.
And we have seen prosecution & compensation arising there from.

But, being even-handed as he no doubt is, he may now care to go further and investigate the plight of thousands of foreign maids abused in Saudi Arabia -many by religious figures -and consider the implications from their very different outcome (?)

Mr Mann & Pericles:
It is not criticism that is at the root of the ill feeling that some Muslims may feel. Christians, Buddhists, Communists etc cop criticism & parody ever day -is it not one of costs/benefits of an open society(?)
Rather the ill feeling/distrust stems from a value system that some Muslims ( & others) live that prescribes that their figureheads & beliefs are above criticism -if anyone challenges them, they have a god driven right to silence them…
And following closely thereupon, a world view that says they will register all injustices done to their group -but none of the injustices their group inflicts on the others…

Pericles
you point out some very important parts of the Sermon on the Mount.
Please bear in mind also.....

That Jesus in the same sermon exhorts us to cut off sinning hands and gouge out sinning eyes...
True understanding of a passage, must come from placing ourselves in the place of the HEARERS of those words in that cultural setting.

The simple fact that Jesus uttered those words on one day, and warned against the scribes and pharisees on another (or the same) means we have to come to grips with the actual intended meaning.

Mr Man.. in terms of your assessment that raising awareness of radical Islam is 'fanning the flames of hate' could you please give your wise counsel regarding this:

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article2409833.ece

Then..you may wish to refer to the transcript of the speeches of the leader of the Deobandi movement, claimed to 'run' 600 of the 1300 mosques in UK..
and then... re-think your statement ?

Who is fanning hate.. those PROMOTING it in speeches like these..OR.. those who point to those speeches as being 'hate rants' ?

Was Hitler the problem. or...those who criticized him ?

Its not rocket science....but sometime prejudice and bias and possibly vested interest ? can alter our perception of such blatant examples of hate and aggression as coming from the Deobandi movement.

Or.. as this Pakistani Judge says:

Justice Muhammad Taqi Usmani argues that Muslims should live peacefully in countries such as Britain, where they have the freedom to practise Islam, only until they gain enough power to engage in battle.

Now.. you may retort "Oh..but the British Muslims are not saying this" to which I reply "Are you sure? and if not, would you expect them to"? Blind Nellie can see though that one.

So...again..WHO is 'fanning hatred'..those who are overtly encouraging Muslims to 'prepare for battle' or..those exposing such rants?

Tolerance is not a luxury we can afford in cases like these.

Boaz, do you ever listen to yourself?

>>...Jesus in the same sermon exhorts us to cut off sinning hands and gouge out sinning eyes...
True understanding of a passage, must come from placing ourselves in the place of the HEARERS of those words in that cultural setting.<<

How many times, Boaz, have you taken a single phrase from the Qur'an, and generalized from it? How many times have you taken a single verse, and drawn from it the conclusion that Islam is irredeemably evil?

There is only one reason that I cannot answer this question for you, and that is because there are, literally, hundreds.

And yet, and yet...

Here you are, bold as brass, telling us that whatever it was Jesus said, he clearly didn't mean it literally.

Does that not strike you as just the teensiest bit hypocritical?

No, I didn't think so.

But it might help you understand why others take this view from time to time, and why your anti-Islamic rants lose their intellectual force when exposed to the light of day.

They are still anti-Islamic rants, though, and help fan the flames of hatred and evil.

You simply refuse to see what is right in front of your nose, don't you?

David

How right you are! Thank You. I dont know how you keep going really You must have a great wish to help others. It kind of sad really.
Pericles Why are you so full of hate towards this lovely women who helps others. Tell me. Tell us all what do you do to help other?
You come in here and snipe at David because he has his eyes open.
You shake with fear so the sake of speakng out. I can see you not stupid so you know the real situation of the world. Ok I get that YOUR scared but why try to stop David from his comments. Why rubbish Kate?

There culture in its political expressin, family affairs, dietary laws, clothng, religis rites, lagauge, etc, is to be imposed on all other cultures.

I am not trying to offend Muslims. I have Muslim friends. However if they wish to come to our free country and they critise us they should no we are also free to speak and defend our own country.
My muslim frends know extreme groups are set on taking the western world over,.. they fear it and so should you.