To Foxy.

According to the articles that I started this topic from the genetic link is only accountable for a very small portion of the characteristics of homosexuality.(that or that the genetic factors identified only account for a very small portion of the gay population in the study). This means to me that the genetic influence is a very small one instead of the smoking gun it's been thought of before. The articles even state that though a genetic influence is identified, there's no way to determine homosexuality by looking at the genes of a person.

With that in mind I would say that the factors that are then more influential are the environmental factors that the study says are also part of the equation. However the environmental factors are not as studied. Or at least I don't know of any studies to identify environmental factors.

That said sexual attraction and preference seems to be strongly not a choice. In fact the arguments of nature verses nurture can be applied to sexuality more then most other behaviors , because people don't choose to be attracted to the same sex or to the opposite sex. I am not arguing that if it's not genetic then it's our choice. But the study seems to point to a genetic influence being a very small one. Not the main influence.

(Continued)

(Continued)

Regarding homosexuality not being normal, as far as I can tell it isn't normal. Banjo Peterson referenced that only 3% of the population identify as homosexual. Normal shouldn't be the frame of mind to decide if it's healthy or not. Adultery among heterosexual I would say is much more normal then any type of homosexual, but adultery is definitely not healthy, instead it kills family ties and cripples relationships. Being more common, and more normal doesn't make anything right/wrong, healthy/unhealthy.

As far as I can tell homosexuality has a lot of unhealthy vices in it. Either because of a cultural phenomenon within homosexual populations with more likely for STIs, abuse, and shallow relationships. Or because only 3% of the adult population is homosexual then that means there is less fish in the sea to choose from for homosexuals to hold standards for in making healthy relationships. Either reasoning, it still is an unfortunate issue that homosexuality can be linked to several other unhealthy elements. For those that are homosexual I think the best option is to strive to be happy being single instead of going from one bad relationship to another, continually thinking they are a failure or otherwise unfit to date because of lack of success. Or worse, find a relationship that is tied to drug abuse and alcoholism.

Regarding the genetics or the environmental factors. If there is more influences in the environment, and if homosexuality has many unhealthy issues. Then I think we should look for what we as a society are doing to add to those influences, and strive to not do them. (If that's even an option. There are no resources or studies I know of to point to the environmental factors in homosexuality. Perhaps those factors are something society can work on, perhaps they are things that can't be removed. Without some study in that area, there are no answers).

.

Dear ,

.

You wrote :

1. « Being gay isn't normal. Whether it should be accepted, tolerated, and encouraged doesn't matter on the basis of it being normal. Normal as far as I can tell means to be common or somewhat common »

As I just indicated to ALTRAV, I simply quoted the Norwegian zoologist, Petter Boeckman, who stated that “There is no such thing in nature as ‘the norm of the heterosexual union’. Both heterosexual and homosexual unions are ‘normal’”.

As regards the “norms” in respect of sexual orientation in Australia, here are the latest statistics :

« In 2014, over half a million people or 3.0% of the adult population identified as gay, lesbian or 'other'. This includes 268,000 people who identified as gay or lesbian and 255,000 people who identified as having an 'other' sexual orientation. Just under 17.0 million adults identified as heterosexual. Identification as gay, lesbian or 'other' varied by age, with high rates in younger age groups » :

http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats/abs@.nsf/mf/4159.0

2. « … based on trusting Christian scripture, I held a private conclusion that if a person is gay the best option is to be celibate »

Celibate, of course, means “abstaining from marriage and sexual relations, typically for religious reasons” (OED).

Celibacy is contrary to the ordinary course of nature. It is abnormal and extremely difficult, if not impossible, to respect. Many have tried and many have failed. It often has quite dramatic consequences such as paedophilia which could otherwise have been avoided.

There is nothing morally reprehensible with homosexuality when it is practised between freely consenting adults. Religious doctrine is ill-founded and should not impose such unnatural behaviour as celibacy.

That said, I fully agree that homosexuality should not be encouraged, but nor should it be discouraged. The Church should not afflict its homosexual devotees with a sense of guilt simply because of the sexual orientation that nature attributed them with. They are no more guilty than devotees whom nature attributed with heterosexual orientation.

That’s not divine justice, Not_Now.Soon. It’s divine discrimination.

.

.

Of course, that was intended for Not_Now.Soon.

Soory about that.

.

To anyone reading this discussion who is homosexual,

I'm sorry if you feel that I am being hateful in this discussion. Either being hateful, being a bigot, or otherwise being oppressive to you all. That is not my intention. The few friends that I know or have known who are gay just show some issues that are a concern to me. A greater dependance in drugs and alcohol is one of those issues. Being set up in shallow, fickle, or abusive relationships is another. It's not out of hate that I suggest to look into lessening the enviomental factors that could cause homosexuality. It's because of concern. After all, one thing I've heard several times from homosexuals is that if they had a choice they wouldn't have chosen to be gay. That in itself should be enough of a red flag to raise up the same issues I'm bringing up about the negitive elements of homosexuality.

Again sorry if this all reads like bigoted or hateful. The concern is real, and the issues are usually ignored, or at least not talked about.

To Banjo Peterson.

Look at the comments I made in the context I made them. In one post you quoted I made a distinction between normal and healthy. Being abnormal doesn't mean unhealthy or healthy, nor does being normal mean being healthy or unhealthy. In that post I did say that homosexuality is not normal. I stand by that assessment. If there was more people who were homosexual then there might be a better chance for healthy, stable, homosexual relationships. Being a very small minority means that there are not plenty of fish in the sea to choose a mate from. That is the unfortunate reality of the size of the population who are homosexual. The point of whether homosexuality is healthy or not, I think should be the focus of your remarks.

The comment on religion being against homosexuals, look at the context of that comment as well. I have been taught that active homosexuality is wrong according to the bible. But I did not know why for a long time. My thoughts on the matter were about striving to be obedient to God, regardless if you knew why it was considered wrong.

However, as I said in the comment you referenced that was then. Now I've come to understand more of the situations around homosexuality. There are issues. Enough of them to justify the bible teaching that condemns homosexual acts. I've said as much in that same comment.

As for absence and celibacy. I don't think those cause as many issues as an actively gay life will cause. In fact an unfortunate issue is pedophilia in gay communities. Men and boys having sex is both a gay issue and a pedophilia issue. They overlap and come up too often to ignore. It would be better to embrace being single then to trivialize and make it sound romantic that a grown man and a teen start a secret relationship.