Paul1405, "I do not dispute that people, including Aboriginal people, have an unacceptably high instances of violence, including violence against women"

Six pages where you had to be dragged kicking to even get that far. Yet you still have your weasel words. 'Nek minit' and you will be back to tors.

Indigenous women and children cannot hope for any enlightenment or a lifeline where you and the Greens are concerned. You are too busy playing politics. The Greens 'Protest' Party needs indigenous victimhood as one of the planks of its political platform.

All to put some pear-shaped Trots into the Senate to polish seats and get stuck into those politicians entitlements and beaut golden handshake with super-dooper pollies' superannuation when wanted. Greens know how to live high on the hog,

"Queensland Greens Senator Larissa Waters spent $414,000 on fitout for Paddington office
RENEE VIELLARIS, MATTHEW KILLORAN THE COURIER-MAIL APRIL 19, 2014

GREENS Senator Larissa Waters spent a whopping $414,000 to fit out her trendy Paddington office – more than any of her Queensland political colleagues at the time.

The office, on the top floor of a pristine-condition, split-level building on Given Tce, includes a rooftop patio with timber outdoor furniture and artificial turf."
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/queensland-greens-senator-larissa-waters-spent-414000-on-fitout-for-paddington-office/story-fnihsrf2-1226889449998

Meanwhile, it is criminal that indigenous leaders, activists and the horde of nasty urgers that depend on indigenous victimhood for their handsome incomes from the public purse, would be demanding a treaties that would restore the 'self-determination' and 'self-management' (shades of Whitlam and Fraser) that for years resulted in the black curtain of elder-introduced black apartheid descending to conceal the corruption, fraud, brutality and regression that ALWAYS result whenever there is loss of transparency and accountability.

The Greens and others play very cynical politics indeed. Their Senate seats first and then, "Don't you worry about that".

Joe, my above comments are not directed at you, but rather my personal observations, you have not said violent behavior and Aboriginality are one in the same thing. You did say " pretty much every anthropologist, including the most captive, admits that their particular group-of-choice is amazingly violent towards women." Do they? Where is your evidence. Do you dispute what my partner has said that tribal Maori were not particularly violent towards women. Please produce the evidence that they were You dis say "I suggested that ALL tribal societies, no matter who and where or on what continent tended to be male-dominated and to 'solve' problems using violence." No one has been more violent than the European. Do you consider the Spanish or the British of recent centuries were tribal, and that is why there were so violent.
"dominated and to 'solve' problems using violence. Yes, that would include my ancestors from different parts of Britain. Although, strangely, none of my convict ancestors were ever up for violent crimes,: Because if they had been, then they would be hanged or at best flogged to within an inch of their lives in a very violent manor Hanging and flogging were part of "civilized" justice, no dofferent to many tribal societies. .

Hi Paul,

Yes, I said " .... pretty much every anthropologist, including the most captive, admits that their particular group-of-choice is amazingly violent towards women."

You asked: "Do they? Where is your evidence. "

Pick one.

Stanner, Sutton, the Berndts, Daisy Bates, Warner, pretty much every missionary in the earlier days (who doubled as our first anthropologists) .... Yes, some skirt very delicately around and away from the issue, as if drawing a veil over such irrelevancies and moving on to children's games.

Not only traditional, or tribal, societies use violence, as you note. Most imperialisms put any traditional society in the shade for violence: the Mongols up to Timur in the early fourteenth century, were amazingly brutal, murdering entire populations of cities, such as Merv. Even the women. Well, perhaps they murdered them afterwards.

Of course, Maori society was more advanced than others, being mainly cultivators, living settled lives, well-organised, and with other means to sanction breaches. As well, their well-organised warfare techniques meant that hapuu could launch into battle over the mistreatment of their women who had married into other hapuu, so mistreatment would not go unnoticed or unpunished. Women had far higher status in Maori societies that most Aboriginal societies: you may wish to argue that one.

Don't worry, Paul, many of my convict ancestors were sentenced to death initially (it was mandatory until the Peel reforms in the 1820s), then given the option of transportation for life. One of my gr-gr-gr-grandmothers knocked back the offer, saying she got sea-sick. They transported her anyway. Pommy bastards.

Cheers,

Joe

Paul,

The levels of domestic violence, child abuse, child neglect and pretty much every other crime is 30x or higher than that of non aboriginal persons.

I heard on an ABC program, a woman saying how bad it was that aboriginal men were almost immediately released after domestic violence and returned to repeat it.

As there are no records of domestic violence in pre settlement aboriginal culture, the assumption that the abuse of women and children then can only be guessed, however, given that the more remote the settlements from modern Australia the worse the violence, it is a bit of a stretch to blame the violence to the settlement of Aus by the British.

Paul1405,

You should let your partner speak on her own behalf. Or at least try to listen outside of that green left echo chamber.

Then you might find out just how ill-directed the policies of the Greens and leftist 'Progressives' really are.

While Polynesian women and children benefitted from a cultural inheritance that for example ensured that children had many mums and the traditional extended family that offered superior nurturing and protection for children and their young mothers, the trashing of motherhood, family by the western middle class career-oriented, materialistic feminists has introduced chaos and resulting harm to Maori women and children.

Same as the mainstream population, where the leftists refuse to acknowledge the unforeseen negative consequences of their social experimentation.

Just more unforeseen negative consequences of the social engineering of leftists and jack-booted feminists who are continually tossing the baby out with the bathwater.

Now the DV and child neglect and abuse numbers for NZ are said to be appalling.

Hi Joe, I don't dispute much of what you say about Aboriginal people, they are plain and undisputed facts, alcoholism, violence, all the negatives. There is a tendency for some, not you, to extenuate the negatives, whilst never alluding to the positives, and there are positives.
I certainly dispute the notion that violence is only a tribal thing. History shows tribal, non tribal, modern societies, all can be violent. In the context of this debate, what is relevant today is how we deal with the violence affecting both aboriginal and non aboriginal people. I think the "big stick" approach is a failure, and we need a better approach. The ideological finger pointing is counter productive.
What do you think?