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The Forum > General Discussion > 'No' to the Death Penalty - Then What ?

'No' to the Death Penalty - Then What ?

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Personally I'm all for gaols to be tent cities out in the desert, guarded by the army and run along army lines.
The guard group to be a Regular Battalion and if there are any escapes and the escapee(s) make it back to civilization then the battalion does another three months duty there as punishment.

There is absolutely no necessity for prisons to be near towns or in cities.
Posted by Is Mise, Friday, 8 May 2015 5:18:09 PM
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Asian gaols, specifically Indonesian, are being lauded by the leftist commentariat as superlative. They can convert drug trafficking thugs into clergy and artists and are diverse, multiculturalist havens too. Blissful and blessed, apparently. The religion that the leftists support when they are not setting fire to Christians.

The answer is obvious then, contract out to the Indonesians and leave them there, to live out their lives in multicultural fulfillment. They wouldn't want to leave and could do good things (reportedly).
Posted by onthebeach, Friday, 8 May 2015 8:35:51 PM
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Hi there RUNNER...

'There are no 'absolutes' any longer' ? Consequently our modern society seems adrift, no longer able to establish a clear protocol for 'correcting' recidivist behaviour, with nothing more then the same weak slap on the wrist ?

The victim no longer has any say as to the punishment of the wrong doer ? Aside from the 'victim's impact statement', that is of course the presiding judiciary member, who's precariously perched atop of his bench, will permit the statement to impact upon the penalty phase ? Some members of the bench don't even listen to the VIS, let alone allow it to have the relevant impact it deserves, upon the penalty decision ?

IS MISE...

You've got a novel suggestion there, as a realistic alternative to spending millions upon new and bigger prisons ? Exile them to an arid desert environment, in an Army styled Military camp ? Easy to erect a 20ft chain wire fence, topped off with strands 'n strands of razor ribbon, with a guard tower located on each corner. Manned 24 hours a day, by a minimum of two officers, with a 'hard' mounted M60, in each Tower that's able to traverse a full 180 degrees. Something not unlike that of 1 MCE (minus the Towers), at Holsworthy ?

And run along Army lines, and staffed by an equal number of Prison Officers from all Australian States. A commonwealth initiative, funded by all the States. Visiting is by special arrangements ? Hey, it's only a suggestion, nothing more ? And not too bad either if one was to consider the specifics much more closely ?

Do you have any observations or suggestions, on this excellent proposal of IS MISE to exile, non-conforming, and/or disruptive crooks. For the express purpose of isolating them from other more conforming prisoners ?

Moreover, ONTHEBEACH you have a very practical mind there my friend, so you should be able to tease out all the nitty gritty that is associated with such a novel proposal, albeit a logistic nightmare ?
Posted by o sung wu, Friday, 8 May 2015 10:26:24 PM
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.

Dear o sung wu,

.

Whereas I consider that the state has an imperious obligation to protect all those within its jurisdiction from individuals who, by their acts, have demonstrated their total lack of respect for the fundamental right to life of human beings, thus forgoing their own fundamental right to life, I do not classify drug traffickers in this particular category of individuals.

I consider that “capital punishment”, or what I prefer to call “euthanasia” (from the Greek, eu, “good” and thanatos, “death”) should be limited to particularly atrocious crimes such as child murder, serial killing, torture murder, rape murder, mass murder, terrorism, and premeditated, cold-blooded, murder that is carefully planned and executed.

By “good death” I mean “a peaceful and painless death, preferably in a warm, cosy environment”, with a maximum of humanity and as least pain, stress and suffering as modern science can allow.

Finding the most appropriate substitute for the execution of Messrs Chan & Sukumaran is no easy task. I am inclined to consider that the decision of the Indonesian judiciary should be respected in its fundamental principle of “permanence”, i.e., “as permanent as death”.

As regards the nature of the legal coercion to be imposed on them “for the rest of their lives” I should be tempted to seek something relating to the nature of their crime. It may be useful to train them to provide assistance to institutions specialising in the detoxification of addicts and abusers of various opioids, benzodiazepines, alcohol, nicotine, barbiturates, and other sedatives and drugs, etc.

This is, perhaps, something useful they could do for society for the rest of their lives, for a small pittance - just enough for them to survive on – whilst permanently wearing an electronic monitoring device.

In my opinion, they should not have the benefit of any possibility of remission of sentence for whatever reason. Their statute should be that of convicted criminals, equivalent to that of prisoners, though they would not be behind bars. In addition, I consider that they should not have the right to retirement as a normal worker.

.
Posted by Banjo Paterson, Saturday, 9 May 2015 1:43:38 AM
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Banjo Paterson, "I do not classify drug traffickers in this particular category of individuals"

There are drug traffickers and drug traffickers. There is a huge difference between those who plan to release commercial quantities of heroin or amphetamine (as examples) in Australia, and others who are moving marijuana.

It is about culpability.
"A person is culpable if they cause a negative event and
(1) the act was intentional;
(2) the act and its consequences could have been controlled (i.e., the agent knew the likely consequences, the agent was not coerced, and the agent overcame hurdles to make the event happen); and
(3) the person provided no excuse or justification for the actions."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culpability
Posted by onthebeach, Saturday, 9 May 2015 1:34:58 PM
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G'day there BANJO PATERSON...

You've raised some interesting points in your thread Banjo ? One is the convoluted or tangled questions posed ? How to administer the death penalty, in the most humane and painless way possible ? For the record, I'm implacably against Capital Punishment per se.

Nations that still practice Capital Punishment, have been seeking more humane, more painless protocols in order to put an offender to death, without generating a chorus of political and public outrage when an execution is badly bungled ? No one should be surprised to hear, the United States is leading the field in this rather unorthodox search ?

I'm sure we've all heard these unfortunate accounts where a lethal injection has gone awry ? Apparently all manner of horrific manifestations have occurred as witnesses watch helplessly as the unfortunate convict descends into the ugly throes of convulsions, and spasms of agony ? While being 'humanely' put to death ?

However it's quite possible to execute an individual, with a rifle or handgun. Providing the targeting is confined to the only effective part of the human anatomy, where death is instantaneous. Much like turning off a light switch.

That is to sever the 'medulla oblongata', located at the base of the cerebral cortex adjacent to the 'pons' (being part of the brain stem), that links the M.O. to the 'thalamus'. All this 'double dutch' is anatomically accurate and a proven way to effect instantaneous death. This 'point of aim' (therefore), 'point of impact' is taught to both FBI & Marine Corps Snipers, as the only 'point of aim' to remove any possibility of a reflex 'kill' by an armed hostage taker.

Make of this as you will ? I attended the FBI Sniper's Instructor's School, in the United States, mid 1986. There's been no further dissimilarity or reason to depart from this policy ?

Naturally, this preferred 'point of aim' is not always possible ? But it's the ONLY part of the entire human anatomy, that guarantees what is known as a; 'non reflex kill' ?

Many thanks for your contribution Banjo.
Posted by o sung wu, Saturday, 9 May 2015 3:52:49 PM
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