Foxy: I don't claim to be any sort of an expert. However, I do glean my information from experts - political commentators who live in the country.

Foxy, I know you have a lot of smarts so you should know, What is said in the Media, what is done at Diplomatic levels, what is said privately & what the people in the street all believe are all poles apart. What is said in the Media is supposed to appease the readers who believe it. The media has to sell papers & the Government has to walk a fine line between the Left who want to save a Drug dealer & the Right who want vengeance for their dead children.

Dear Jayb,

That is precisely why I use a variety of sources not only
the Main Stream Media. Independent media provides alternative
information to what the MSM presents - and it also aims to
challenge existing powers.

Fox,

You are consistently naive, clueless on SEAsia.

You do need to travel and see for yourself that what I said in mt earlier post is diplomatic, an understatement.

My post: onthebeach, Saturday, 21 February 2015 10:59:27 AM

You need to widen your vistas beyond those 'independent' sites.

Actually, linking the aid to Aceh with what Australia wants now was a terrible cultural gaffe that would have gone down like a lead balloon, and terribly damaged Australia's reputation amongst the Indonesian people.

To understand why, you need to understand what "ungkit-ungkit" means in Bahasa Indonesia.

To translate into Australian, you could perhaps say:

"To dig up the past"

but to place it into context, if one gives something in Indonesian, and then at a later point goes looking for some advantage, that it to say, that which which was taken to be given as a gift unconditionally, is to incur a great loss of face and as said, a great loss of reputation.

So, clearly, Australia is being advised by extremely culturally knowledgeable people (NOT) and worse still, if the guvment is not serious about its word, i.e. pull foreign aid in its entirety from Indonesia if it does not comply, then we will become something of a great joke.

..

But then who takes seriously people who abuse children anyway.

otb,

You have no way of knowing the extent of my knowledge
on any subject. You are merely making assumptions
because possibly my opinions don't happen to agree
with yours.

You seem to be determined to see everything through
a conservative prism - and if the reality doesn't
fit your predilections that reality is ignored.

The day that you change your posting style, and are
not hostile to evidence and reason - is the day
that I shall give your advice more credibility.
Until then -
it's best that you work on yourself first, before
advising anyone else on this forum.

DreamOn, "Actually, linking the aid to Aceh with what Australia wants now was a terrible cultural gaffe that would have gone down like a lead balloon, and terribly damaged Australia's reputation amongst the Indonesian people"

Agreed.

The cultural 'experts' who advise government remind me of that fake who provided sign language interpretation on stage for Nelson Mandela's memorial service, attended by scores of heads of state, and was simply "making childish hand gestures" for hours.

The cultural experts are unaware for example of the strong commitment made by Indonesia and its neighbours to free themselves from the scourge of drug trafficking. Drug use is hugely expensive for the health budget. The spread of HIV for instance is also linked to drug use. They were encouraged in their commitment by Australia, which arguably had everything to gain because almost all of the drugs produced in SEAsia are consumed in the region.

Now here is Australia, silent until two of its own serious criminals are caught cold with a swag of heroin, going well outside of the realms of diplomatic decency and friendship, patronising, embarrassing and nagging them.

Fox,
Get on a plane and visit SEAsia. Try out your leftist 'Progressivism' there.

Honestly, you have no idea how patronising you are to Indonesians and dismissive of the problems they face as a second world country trying to rid themselves of drugs when there are many thousands of well-off, fat-assed professionals and other soy latte sippers here elbowing one another out of the way to buy drugs.