Dear Shockadelic,

<<Then why are they here? You don't move half way around the planet to *not* be part of another society.>>

Rather than using "they", I can speak for myself:

I actually did move half way around the planet - and it was not in order to become part of another society. Since I was escaping a worse society, I accepted the Australian society as a fair and reasonable compromise, but if I had the option to live in this continent without it, then I would be even happier.

<<And what of the combined power of a united people?>>

Each individual should be able to live their life as they wish, so long as they do not hurt others: no neighbourhood/city/region/state/nation has any legitimate power over my life.

Most children however have a problem: for the time-being they are unable to fully understand their surrounding circumstances and express their wishes clearly enough, so instead they are represented by their parents.

Similarly, when you are in court and are not a legal expert, you are represented by a lawyer of your choice. Assuming you and your lawyer(s) are on the same wavelength, you together have the same powers as if you were competently defending/representing yourself.

(and if you aren't on the same wavelength, then you can always dismiss your lawyer(s) and look for another)

This is the 'power' I was referring to: any other interpretation is merely playing with my words and taking them out of context.

<<Have you heard any outcry from the Australian people about it?>>

Irrelevant, Argumentum ad populum!

It is wrong to impose my will on others, including about when they may or may-not marry. If the state does so in my name, then it's my duty to protest, even if nobody else does.

<<"the tyranny of anti-nose-pickers." Your example is fatuous. No such "tyranny" would ever exist.>>

This of course is only an example to demonstrate the absurdity of trying to control others. I do hope and believe that you are capable of generalised abstract-thinking, when you want...

(continued...)

(...continued)

<<Where controversial laws are made, there is no end to the public response, so they tend to get repealed/amended pretty quick>>

My experience is very different. In 1990 I was about to purchase a bicycle: just then it was established to be a criminal-offence to ride without wearing a pot on one's head, which I'm not willing to do. So I didn't buy that bicycle and today, 24 years later I'm still prevented from riding a bicycle in Australia (other than the stationary ones at the gym).

Dear Banjo,

<<If you believe the crap you wrote in your last two posts, you are a nutter.>>

So are you calling Mother-Nature herself (or Charles Darwin) a nutter?
- for it's they, not me, who decided that a girl can give birth around the age of 12!

<<Have a look at some figures relating to deaths of young females in third world countries that are a direct result of getting pregnant and giving birth too young.>>

People should be able to take risks, if they so freely choose.

<<Then come back and tell me a girl of 10 or 12 can make rational and considered decisions regarding marriage.>>

Some can, some not. That's what parents are for, not the state.

(as a side-note, rationality or lack thereof should not be a precondition for free choice)

On polygamy, anyone can write a will overriding marriage altogether.

ITS FUNNY..HOW ACCOMMODATING[Without being intimidating]?

WAKE-up..the..[pub*lick sir*vants]..have let us down
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?discussion=6152&page=0#178808

if/yOUR..PAYING THE BILLS/TIME..YOU KNEW WHY
http://board.freedomainradio.com/page/books/the_handbook_of_human_ownership_a_manual_for_new_tax_farmers.html
arjay/quote..<<>.This pre-occupation with illegals..>>

WILLING/TO..WORK..FOR FREE.<<<is a just a distraction from the real game of looting..our economies and keeping us peasants subjugated>>
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=16224&page=0

see how they sell suburbia/REPLACEMENT/CULTURE..TO US..in sitcoms
we bought..into the dream..instead of family[PICK/A FAMILY/PICK..FRIENDS]

we are..'the team'[JUDGE/JUDY/COP-SHOWS/FOOTY/SOME BALL/'BROADCAST'
or the state..or the nationality..or the sex..or the skin..GROUP/MOB

my point is we are all..being made..over into clones..SET WAGE/ACIODING/TO..THE STANDARD.O.OF WORK/EXPECTED..FROM A FORCED SLAVE..

ONE BRUSH TARS..US ALL/
WE ARE ALL SINNERS/WE ARE ALL IMMIGRANTS...BEGGING..FOR WORK

we are..all..SPOILED/BELOVED..children..enjoined living mortal heirs of..the one most holy living living merciful immortal/omnipresenowholly spirit.

how to explain..to loved ones..whats going on
globally..is they give us foodstamps..or subsistence dole/PENAL TITHE/RATE/CASAUAL/AT CALL.ONE SIZE FITS ALL

where most half/govt income..goes back direct to some capitalist ..landlord/tax free.[off shored trust]..stealing govt/bailout cash..from..slaves..working/for\dole.

[we ARE SEEING REAL-ESTATE UP..AGAIN IN IRELAND..yet..still 5000 ghost estates..they bought up pennies in the pound..stand empty

but/what if*..we could..get cash/from govt via rent assistance for immigrants ..nice sure govt cash-flow..to fill to fill the capitalist bill..dole/rent assistance..

[yet more drain/from the public purse..filled only by selling more public services..[privatisations..of govt income streams..or by ever more sin taxes or fees fines revenue acces chargES/other increases in govt theft..[read tax burden]

WE ARE SEEING HOUSES GO UP/..YET/SEEING EVICTIONS AND REPOSSESSIONS..homeless joblessness broken homes..go up to

THEN..HUGE GOVT..bailout/mates..with TAX ADVANTAGED FIRMS CREATING THE NEXT INVESTMENT BOND..bubble..[bunded RENTED HOUSING]...damm caps..ie the next bubble[rental houses paid for immigrants via dole payments]

its a hidden bailout/
THE GROWTH MODEL DEMANDS
but..ONLY PUTS further NON PRODUCTIVE/Burden on us...ALL .GLOBALLY..
http://rss.infowars.com/20140417_Thu_Alex.mp3

i wish people would..get the facts
http://whatreallyhappened.com/node
GIVE THINGS A REST
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=16225&page=0

A footnote on <<polygamy>>

When I mentioned above that: <<A friend of mine who was involved in delivery charity parcels reported that he observed a huge number of cases where the marriage laws of Oz were being openly flouted.>>

I was taking about polygamy. My friend who incidentally is of Middle Eastern origin observed many situations --in his community -- where a man would have different wives in different locations, each separately registered for govt benefits and charity handouts.

I have to laugh at Yuyutsu's (naive) points:

<<For a family, therefore, who wishes to integrate into modern Western society, marrying and having a baby at 12 is inappropriate, mainly because it would interfere with the girls' studies and job-prospects>>

<<However, one should not arbitrarily assume that people wish to integrate into their society unless those people actually expressed that desire. If one for example (either parent or child) asked the state for welfare-payments or schooling, then that constitutes an implicit desire to integrate >>

According to my friend:
1)Such *families* hadn't the slightest concern re the girls education or job prospects. Believing a womans role was in the home, making babies.

2) They saw being registered for govt & charity benefits as in no way reflecting a desire or commitment integrate !

Dear SPQR,

Regarding your second point, you can't eat the cake and have it too:

If you wish to receive the benefits of Western society, then you should pay the price for it as well.

Regarding your first point, as to what families believe in, your suggestion is only one among many possibilities:

Another family for example may believe that their daughter is destined to be a traditional Shaman/healer and that her marriage at a young age to a male Shaman and having a baby to him is an essential part of that path, providing her with both education and a career (this is just an example, so please don't assume that I believe in shamanism like Shockadelic who takes me too literally).

The first and foremost sacred freedom is the freedom from society - either from society in general or from a specific society one doesn't wish to be part of. However, once one freely chooses to participate in a society, then one is rightly bound by its rules.

If you were reading my previous posts, you would already know that I respect the girl's freedom above all. A 12 year old girl, should she so choose, should have no problem walking to a police-station (or any other institute, even just a shop, or by making a phone-call) and asking for refuge and asylum from her family.

tsu/quote..<<..Modern and especially Western society..is very complex and unnatural,...so one is not ready to function independently within it by the age of 8.>>..

THAT IS A GOOD POINT
NATURE=SURVIVAL OF FIT-TEST..BUT OUR SOCIETY..IS MORE MIND OVER NATURE..EVEN TO NURTURE OVER NAture/aor at expense.of nature[ie we deep think..on every-think]

<<..Instead, one requires about 10 more years of education/indoctrination to be considered 'mature'.>>

no that suited/us..in our day..now a days it takes 12..just for the stuff we learnt/then 8 years to catch up on the changes SINCE THEN/THE PROBLEM IS WE BEEN FORCING OUR KIDS TO LEARn twice as much as we did..in the saME TIME

<<>.Even then we find people in society..who are still immature at the age of 80!>>THAT FORCED ME TO RECALL/ONLY 30 YEARS AGO..RETARDS WERE ONE IN 3000..[TODAY ITS ONE IN 75]..DUE TO ENVIRONMENTAL POLLUTIONS AND VACCINATION 'SIDE AFFECT'

<<>.For a family, therefore, who wishes to integrate into modern Western society, marrying and having a baby at 12 is inappropriate, mainly because it would interfere with the girls' studies and job-prospects.>>

and forcing..a civilised child back into nature ONLY DRIVES THEM INSANE/THERE COMES THAT TIME..WE MUST STANDUP/AND SAY..WE DIO IT DIUFFERENTLY..TODAY

<<>> However, one should not arbitrarily assume that people wish to integrate into their society unless those people actually expressed that desire.>>>

SIMPLE TO GET IN [OR STAY]..EACH MUST SWEAR IT TRUE?
TEST IF THEY GET WHY?

<<.. If one for example (either parent or child) asked the state for welfare-payments or schooling, then that constitutes an implicit desire to integrate>>

AND AVAILABLE ONLY BY ASSUMING ONGOING FOLLOWING OF OUR SOCIETY CIVIL RULE..not forced nor enforced moralistic fundraising

<<.. - but room must always be left for those families who do not wish to have anything to do with modern Western society and/or the states it created.>>.

without society benefit..any burden is unjust
privileges HAVE A PRICE..FREEDOM HAS ITS COST.
iFits a hidden bailout/THE GROWTH MODEL DEMANDS
THAt..ONLY PUTS further NON PRODUCTIVE/Burden on us...ALL .GLOBALLY..
http://rss.infowars.com/20140417_Thu_Alex.mp3

i wish people would..get the facts
http://whatreallyhappened.com/node
GIVE THINGS A REST
http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=16225&page=0