Re my last post, SM responds on another thread: "As for your infantile challenge..........insisting that I can only reference "Labor's official position" whilst commenting on their communication with the public is pathetic. Perhaps you would care to re frame your challenge so as not to look like a dunce.

Keeping SM accountable for his sleight of hand with the truth is always enjoyable, but it does bring squirming and abuse. Ho-hum. OK, SM, if "Labor" perpetrated a lie, which Labor spokesperson on behalf of his/her party was it? Where and when?

If you can't at least do that then you must have, yet again, simply been enjoying the aroma of your own flatulence

Luciferase, maybe I've misunderstood your challenge? SM claims that Labor's biggest lie is to suggest that "Australia's carbon tax will have any effect on the environment without global consensus." You challenge him to point to evidence for that as part of Labor's "official position".

Surely the only reason that Labor has introduced a price on carbon is due to the impact of climate change? Certainly their broader Clean Energy Future seeks to do a lot more towards transforming many aspects of Australian business and society, but the carbon tax is specifically about reducing CO2 'pollution' in order to mitigate climate change.

See here:
http://www.climatechange.gov.au/government/adapt.aspx where in the very first line it states "It is important that Australia reduce its carbon pollution to minimise the severity of climate change".

I think that states pretty clearly that the government expects that reducing carbon emissions is a key step to helping mitigate climate change, or more bluntly, have an effect on the environment.

Oh and lest you claim that that page doesn't necessarily mention the carbon tax, you might read this page from the same site:
http://www.climatechange.gov.au/government/Carbon%20Pricing%20Policy.aspx

I'm personally not critical of the government for acting although I do not agree with the strategy, but I think you are being disingenuous if you want to pretend that Labor is not pricing carbon as a mechanism for affecting the environment. That is EXACTLY why they are doing it.

Or am I just misunderstanding you?

Graeme M, to SM's statement: "I think that the single biggest lie perpetrated by Labor, is that Australia's carbon tax will have any effect on the environment without global consensus."

I'm not seeing anything in your references that supports this statement. See here on the same website to which you refer me, further clarification regarding the global environmental aspect where it says "Climate change is a global problem that requires a global solution." http://www.climatechange.gov.au/en/government/international.aspx

Furthermore, Flannery's Climate Commission also sets out why Australia should act on climate change mitigation without making silly claims (or perpetrating a lie as SM would have it). Even if it did baldly lie its report is introduced with, "IMPORTANT NOTICE – PLEASE READ
This document is produced for general information only and does not represent a statement of the policy of the Commonwealth of Australia."
http://climatecommission.gov.au/wp-content/uploads/climatecommission_internationalReport_20120821.pdf

Australia's carbon footprint reduction may only affect AGW in a very small way. There is the presumption, in setting a carbon tax, that countries not already doing something about AGW will follow in time with similar carbon mitigation measures (as is happening).

Who would logically support an Australian CT on the basis it alone can affect the global environment? It's about doing our part while setting an example for/guiding others.

No Graeme Y, this is about SM occasionally being held accountable, just so he doesn't smugly think he's getting away with it all the time. His sleight of hand is legendary and if he wants to chant the LNP mantra on OLO, he has to accept inevitable challenges forced by its inherent flaws. I await his response to my challenge other than squirming and abuse.

See LF,

Graeme M has nailed you in one.

The way Labor talks continuously is that Climate change is here and that a carbon tax is needed to save Australia. The reality that without a global accord, this will happen even with a carbon tax is airbrushed from their rhetoric. So LF, to hold your BS to account I challenge you to provide a references where labor have discussed the net contribution that the carbon tax makes to the global emissions in real terms nor in airy "we will show the way" terms.

Labor pollies have been frequently asked the question of what difference the Australian carbon tax will have on the global environment, and not one of them will even answer the question, because the answer is zero, or so small that it cannot be measured. The argument that others will follow our lead has been shown to be false.

Or even explain while Australia needs the world's biggest, most encompassing carbon tax to do "our part" noting that Australia's carbon tax has already raised more revenue than the EU's has ever.

LF well said, but you are up against it.
Are you aware some left this place because of the bloke.
I left 3 times but came back because it is the best site.
Others never did,or changed names on return.
I have a question, one on first sight looks silly.
*What impact has the present government had on public opinion on climate change*
While it looks silly, how could an international problem be put down to Labor.
Judging only by many posts, some base posts on pure anti Labor thoughts