Siller.
If you have access to a university library read this study and then report back to us, from the abstract it seems to explore the issues you raise, I can't access it so you'll have to read it and give me the gist of it:
http://dtl.unimelb.edu.au/R/J1Y11HXR6NV66TP24K13DV4D7YLUA3JL31GJ725GPJ75S6B134-03347?func=dbin-jump-full&object_id=264824&pds_handle=GUEST

Jay of Melbourne
Unfortunately Jay I do not have access to a university library. Perhaps another reader could access this study and report the contents back to us.

Wassar madda csteel? Cat got ya tongue. Is ittie bitie steelie embarrassed by what you stand for? If I were you , I would be.

Oh well, see you in the next round ;-) Ban the Quran, NOW! Yeeay!

Jayb,

Yes, we've heard about the Islamic 'principle' of tukkiah, the right to lie to and cheat Infidels, indeed to enslave them if possible (after all, they aren't believers, so they are fair game, to an pre-civilized mind-set) but the right to have sex with goats - really ? Can you cite the appropriate hadith ? Or is that just a long-standing, pre-Islamic, desert tradition, not eally Islamic at all ?

Somewhere the Koran also says that geckos are evil, vile little creatures, and should be destroyed, but I didn't realise that there was so much affection for goats. Donkeys as well ?

What about chickens ?

Cheers,

Joe

Ayatollah Khomeini’s Little Green Book

The leader of the Iranian Revolution in 1989, Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, wrote extensively on Islamic Jurisprudence. A two-volume book, which was published originally in Arabic, was called ‘Tahrir al Wasilah’. Translated into Farsi, the book is called “Tahrirolvasyleh. Khomeini also had another treatise on Islamic rules for living, called in English, “The Little Green Book.”

It is useful to understand what an esteemed Islamic leader such as the Ayatollah teaches his followers.

Here are some excerpts from “Tahrirolvasyleh” which Muslims probably don’t want you to know about Islam:

A man can have sexual pleasure from a child as young as a baby. However, he should not penetrate vaginally, but sodomising the child is acceptable. Any father marrying his daughter so young will have a permanent place in heaven.
A man can have sex with animals such as sheep, cows, camels and so on. However, he should kill the animal after he has his orgasm. He should not sell the meat to the people in his own village, but selling the meat to a neighbouring village is reasonable.

Wine and all intoxicating beverages are impure, but opium and hashish are not.

If one commits the act of sodomy with a cow, a ewe, or a camel, their urine and their excrement become impure and even their milk may no Any father marrying his daughter so young will have a permanent place in heaven. It is not illegal for an adult male to ‘thigh’ or enjoy a young girl who is still in the age of weaning; meaning to place his penis between her thighs, and to kiss her.

A religious decree by Khomeini ordered that girl prisoners who are virgins must be raped before execution, to prevent them from entering heaven. A Guard conducts the rape the night before execution. The next day, a marriage certificate is issued by a mullah, who sends it to the girl’s family, along with a box of chocolates as a wedding gift.

The complete text can be found in "Ayatollah Khomeini in Tahrirolvasyleh, Fourth Edition, Darol Elm, Qom"

Thanks for those clarifications, Jayb. I'm still a bit puzzled about geckos, though.

I was struck by that part: "A man can have sex with animals such as sheep, cows, camels and so on. However, he should kill the animal after he has his orgasm. He should not sell the meat to the people in his own village, but selling the meat to a neighbouring village is reasonable."

The Bulgarian-French sociologist Todorov suggests that a mark of civilized behaviour is to think of the Other as similar to oneself, while the mark of uncivilized societies is to consider Others as alien and non-human, to whom rules of proper behaviour do not apply, and therefore to whom anything can be done, including enslavement and, in the Ayatollah's case, the selling of contaminated meat.

Is it drawing too long a bow to suggest that, in Islam, or some versions of it, men may consider some - what others would call - animals, such as sheep, cows, camels etc. - as fellow-creatures, not Other - while they would be taught from birth that women are Other ? Including their own women ?

What a grotesque world some people must inhabit.

No, I still don't understand about geckoes. Such beautiful, friendly, harmless and happy-seeming creatures.