Hi Reason,

Yes indeed, children should be introduced early to concepts of right and wrong, good and bad, i.e. ethics and morals, perhaps by having simple moral dilemmas posed to them, so that yes, they can gain a more sophisticated, sympathetic, complex understanding of human behaviour, and develop empathy towards others, no matter what their 'Otherness', when they see or hear or read about other people in difficult situations. i.e. to feel empathy for the 'Other'.

Perhaps it is the mark of a genuinely civilized population that its 'members' can generally feel empathy for OTHER people, in OTHER parts of the world, or in strange situations. For example, the outrage most of us felt at the invasion of Iraq, or the genocide in Rwanda, or when Malala Yousafzai was shot in the face for wanting to get an education, in a land with a religion of peace

Certainly the mark of an UNcivilized population, in my view, is the lack of any feeling for the dilemmas and tragedies that might befall the members of an 'Other' population - I was reading an economic history of Spain and was surprised to note that the wonderfully creative Muslims, expounding their religion of peace, always had at least fifty thousand slaves - non-Muslim of course - at work on their estates and grand buildings. i.e. in UNcivilized societies, nobody feels empathy for the 'Other'.

That sort of half-explains how there can be a manifestly uncivilized society which, at the same time, can oversee the building of beautiful palaces and mosques, and of long-distance water reticulation systems, etc - a MORALLY uncivilized society which is simultaneously an advanced engineering and archigtectural society.

That got me thinking: most powerful authoritarian societies go on about their architecture, the Nazis, Mussolini's Fascists, the Soviets, even that ghastly Bauhaus stuff. James C. Scott has written beautifully on this subject, if anybody wants to follow up on it.

Cheers,

Joe

Hmmm... Well 4 days & no response from Iffie. & no response from the Islamist apologists like csteel, poirot or Lexi either. I wonder why?

We did good fellers, we did good. I good dose of reality every now & again works wonders. ;-)

Thanks Jayb, but I certainly don't think that's the last we will hear of 'special rights for minority cultures' etc.

It's the one reason I am not enthusiastic about anything relating to Aboriginal people in the new-and-improved constitution - in my experience, it seems that the Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away, and what seems on the surface to be mildly beneficial, turns out much later to do great damage, in this case to widen the 'Gap'.

Equal rights for all, yes, including the right to be counted as the owners of land that one's ancestors had exclusive control over, but no special rights. Boring, isn't it ?

Cheers,

Joe

Loudmouth:It's the one reason I am not enthusiastic about anything relating to Aboriginal people in the new-and-improved constitution - in my experience, it seems that the Lord giveth and the Lord taketh away, and what seems on the surface to be mildly beneficial, turns out much later to do great damage, in this case to widen the 'Gap'.

You are right. I think the problem stems from the difference between the Townies & the Bushies. Most of the townies would know what Bush was & vice versa.

Politicians try to make Laws to deal with Aboriginals as one Group & it doesn't/hasn't work. What is good for one group is detrimental for the other.

Have we got the right thread here?

Nice to see "The Others" have kept up the debate on Muslim Academies.

Hi Jayb,

It's relevant to the notion of Madrasas in Australia - so-called 'cultural privileges' which do so much damage to the social fabric of Australia, and to the recipients.

In reality, Indigenous children in remote parts of the N.T. have had the 'cultural privilege' of 'special', 'different' education for the last forty years, usually at the hands of unqualified local people, i.e., in their own languages, i.e. they have become barely monolingual, illiterate and innumerate - to the point, so I've heard, that when young people want to go to town to, say, buy a car, they have to take their grand-dad with them because he's more like to speak English and to know how to read and write.

Of course, it's a similar process but different situation for Muslim kids, in urban Australia. But the upshot of special, different education will, I fear, produce equally useless adults who don't know how to function in a high-tech, and fundamentally secular, economy and society like Australia's.

In the Muslim case, those young adults of the future would, in that scenario, be shut out, will have shut themselves out, of the economy, and will be understandably resentful and bitter - but blaming the rest of Australia rather than their own teachers.

With predictable outcomes.

Cheers,

Jo

Point taken.