Ludwig not so!
In fact a return to Rudd now,and Shorten next, fixes the ALP.
Little known truth Kevin Rudd wants an ALP that is not controlled by? union power brokers such as? Bill Shorten.
Bill is a Brilliant man, one the party in time, Must turn to, at the right time.
Not now, not enough time exists for the task ahead, your view of Rudd, is not shared by all, his installation is an instant coffee fix to polling.
We you and I want population limits.
We are but two small frogs, in a pond packed with them, all with a different view.
EVERY party, driven by commercial interests, chases growth, wealth creation, jobs, growth at any costs, including population.
No party can be elected if it insists on planet /country before profit, yet.
Carr wins your support because he, like us, understands we head for trouble, his anti big city's stuff is legendary, and right, but not shared.
This week the war begins, a day,maybe this week, will come that unmasks Abbott, leading to his fall.
Labor has one problem, that is not it policy's,they are great!NDIS!
NBN! Carbon tax, who else but our only reformist party.
But Gillard?
While she and her self interested knife wheedlers wander the Parliament Labor will not be forgiven.

<< In fact a return to Rudd now,and Shorten next, fixes the ALP >>

I couldn’t disagree more, Belly!

And even if it was so, what about the country??

Rudd is just so totally anitsustainability short-term-oriented. Remember it was he who boosted immigration to a new record level, ncreasing Howard's long term record level, as soon as he got into power, without a mention of any such thing in the election campaign or the copious television appearances he did in the year or so before that.

We absolutely don’t need someone who will just promulgate the same old growth-is-the-answer-to-everything doctrine, no matter what sort of growth it is or what downsides it has.

The management of growth is critical to our future. And by all accounts, Rudd has no idea at all of how to do this.

And Shorten is of just the same ilk.

<< No party can be elected if it insists on planet /country before profit, yet. >>

Interesting comment. So you are saying that Labor does indeed put profits first, ahead of planet, country, quality of life, environment and everything else?

You’re not far wrong. And therein lies the greatest discontent with the Australian people for the current Labor government, and for the Labor party overall, and for the opposition!

So we DESPERATELY need to break away from this. And Carr is just the person to lead such a revolt!

Not all labour politicians are corrupt but labour seems to attract more than its share of pollies with their nose in the trough. Most of the recent New South Wales labour government were on a feeding frenzy (Palazano, Macdonald, Demore, Obeid, Roozendaal, Tripodi etc.)
There are a lot of unanswered questions about Gillard and Bruce Wilson (Wilson is a reputed shyster). Craig Thomson probably typifies the problem in that he comes from a union background where there are free sandwiches for all and he carries that culture with him into the political arena. This culture becomes much more serious when the players have a legal background and it takes on more expensive tastes and becomes shrouded in the cotton wool of our legal system

Ludwig,
If you lived in NSW you would not hold your view of Bob Carr. He just got out in time, before the Labor problems became exposed. Not popular here.

Belly,
I see more dark days ahead for you.

Can a lid be kept on this Gillard/AWU issue much longer?

Then there is an ICAC investigation into the activities of some former NSW Labor politicians.

Then there is the NBN financial blow outs to be added to the already 50 plus labor stuff ups.

How long before those with disabilities see that they are being conned into believing there will be a scheme set up to benefit them? At present there is no substance to anything and no way of financing it. Another Labor 'pie in the sky' scheme?

<< Ludwig, If you lived in NSW you would not hold your view of Bob Carr. He just got out in time, before the Labor problems became exposed. Not popular here. >>

Granted, Banjo.

But is there any such thing as an ex-premier who was popular… anywhere in the country, over the last couple of decades?

He was always talking about population growth, especially the growth of Sydney, right from the start of his long tenure as premier, and indeed for many years before that.

His conviction pertaining to population stabilisation and hence the core issues of sustainability are rock solid. This is what makes him the only real choice for Labor leader, apart from Kelvin Thomson, if they are to reinvent themselves in the manner that will win them support and be right for the country’s future.

Banjo, what do you think of Kelvin Thomson? If we are to have someone with no baggage as the new Labor leader, then he’s da man, yes?

Ludwig! mate! do not let your anger hide this truth in my words, you and I think differently than most.
MOST are driven not by sustainability, not by understanding growth is not always good.
Most want the home and land prices to rise, they hear as they did today, Australia, needs 800.000 new skilled workers!
They dream of new towns, roads city's, they do not share, yet, our views .
Yes folks NSW is tainted by its past, one I first spoke of when it was the present.
Now the AWU scandal? from the 1990,s? are you ,those who have just heard about it, sure the idiotic Gillard had ANYTHING to do with it?
And let us be honest, yes Labor has its criminals, I have been talking of them for over half a decade.
Can you tell me who left politics on Liberal/National side after scandals looked to be close to the white wash falling away.
Reith, the man who last held Oakshots seat, want to go on.
Today my party will start the removal of Gillard or abandon its grass roots.