Belly, I empathise with your position, but I don't even think
its Gillard. Its simply the structure of the Govt that is very
weak, which is a shame really. So she is totally hamstrung by
this situation.

*because any good business sector shouldn't be ignoring it.*

Csteele, most Australian meat is actually exported, so the locals
are less important. To put it bluntly, your brother clearly acted
irrationally, for of course his meat was slaughtered locally. The
less meat he eats, the more might land up as live exports on a boat,
because it all has to go somewhere.

Eventually it might dawn on him that he gave up meat for no reason
other then to feel better, for totally irrational reasons. Let him
eat lettuce, others will enjoy their chops and roasts, slaughtered
humanely. We'll see how long he lasts until he is back eating meat.

Most vegans do it for deeply ideological reasons. But they don't
even agree with shooting foxes and other vermin, they think we
should put them all on the pill. Most of it is based on a book
called "Animal Liberation" by philosopher David Singer.

Yabby

>> Most of it is based on a book
called "Animal Liberation" by philosopher David Singer. <<

Sometimes I think you get your ideas out of breakfast cereal packets. Vegetarians have been a part of the human population since we climbed out of the trees.

There is nothing wrong with not eating meat nor is there anything wrong with improving the conditions for the animals from which we derive much of our protein.

I really have to wonder just what you (and Belly) are objecting to? Change? Your vested interests?

Dear belly,

Jeez mate, some times it just isn't all about politics. This is also about ethics and good business practices.

If you are determined to stand in a corner screaming it is all the Green's fault then I suppose that is your right but if others see your actions as narrow-focussed foolishness then don't be surprised.

Most Australians know when something is broken and are prepared to get on with it and get the damn thing fixed.

There might be some discussion on how that should be achieved but just sticking your head in the sand and blaming others ain't going to get it done.

You forgot to point out, Ammonite, that David came from the corn
flakes packet, for of course its Peter Singer, so much for my
memory.

Peter Singer has indeed had a huge influence on the vegan movement
and various animal liberation groups. IIRC he was also one of the
founders of Animals Australia, which represents all sorts of animal
groups.

Did you note the word "most" in my claim? Perhaps as usual,
you paid no notice. Yes veggies have existed for ages, but that
has little to do with the profound effect that Singer has had
on the Australian scene. He actually went to university with
alot of the people who are trying to close down the live trade
today.

Dear Yabby,

From the Australian on the 7th:

"THE Australian Meat Industry Council yesterday called on Canberra to suspend all live cattle exports to Indonesia after domestic sales dropped 15 per cent in the last week."

"AMIC executive Tom Maguire warned that the slump in domestic sales -- following a week of reports of cattle being tortured in Indonesian abattoirs -- could outstrip any shutdown of the entire live export industry, worth more than $1 billion annually."

"Mr Maguire called on the federal government -- which last week halted exports to 12 Indonesian abattoirs -- to suspend the trade of all cattle to Indonesia immediately to restore faith in the industry."

Seems there are quite a few 'irrational' Australians making ethical decisions. Domestic sales still account for over 40% of the industry. If you are happy to see it take a 15% hit and laugh it off then I think the producers should be damn glad they don't have someone like yourself in charge.

People like Mr Maguire aren't trying to tell people they are irrational he is too busy trying to restore faith in his industry and stop the hemorrhaging of customers. It is pragmatic and good business. In his world your ideology is worse than unhelpful.

Yabby

Very artful, making YOUR mistakes out to be mine. Kudos.

However, you still haven't made your case for business-as-usual.

Vested Interests?