*the solution is to keep their hands from the levers of government*

Exactly Csteele, but don't forget that in their culture, the West
is seen as piss weak. They use that to their advantage in tactical
terms. That is why the drones matter and indeed they are getting
results.

*A redirect if I may. Do you agree with Australia's position on landmines and cluster bombs and do you agree with their use by the US in Afghanistan?*

Csteele, I try not to see the world through your eyes of black and white,
then pontificate from the sidelines as you do. I try and understand the
shades of grey involved. I have no problem with
Australia's position. I can also understand the US position, of keeping
options open in a game of strategics. Telling your enemy
that you will under no circumstances use land mines, gives that
enemy a clear advantage of not having to worry about mines in their
planning. Hardly a clever thing to do.

No offense thinker 2, csteele cards on the table.
It is your thread
And about drones, a weapon that targets enemy combatants.
You, as we develop the thread pull cluster bombs and poison gas out of your sleeve and put them on the table.
I wish to yet again,,, counter with human bombs, car bombs, targeting civilians Children and religious ceremony's.
You while cwafing your IL gotten red, infer I am a rough neck, taken as a complement.
Can I pull rockets targeting Israeli villages on the table.
I would like to know what part of the world you come from.
I think you could tell us that, how are you going with your investigation in to Boazy and the other poster, both here now,and this morning together.
So summing it up, I think the thread is evidence enough you target drones for targeting murderers but give only passing interest to targeted murders of women, children and any one in fact unless it is done by, and it never is, Americans on purpose,
Hope every one had a great Aussie day, donated to flood victims and did not burn our flag, it has happened you know.

Dear Belly and Yabby,

As I am on the road again today I will have to wait until this evening to properly address your posts but I did want to take Belly up on something.

What on earth does what part of the world I come from have any bearing on the validity of the arguments I have posted in this thread?

Don't think I am avoiding the question and will give you an answer after I hear from you.

As to AGIR/SPQR after a little investigation then an indication from you that it would mean nothing to our debate I had decided to let it slide. More than happy to pick it up again if you think it will make a difference.

Let us not wander into the PC mud csteele your question may get me into trouble.
But here it is some nations are known to be wingers, biased constantly complaining about every one.
Not so?
You bet it is.
It is you who avoid answering questions not me.

Dear belly,

Still a few hours from home quaffing a Red Rock Cabernet. I have always consider PC simply as us attempting to call for good manners but I'm happy to wallow in some un-PC mud with you. My mate has bet me you are a pommie ex-union official based on the number of times you whinged about the Left in your first dozen posts. I thought you might be first generation. No wine bet on this one though. Me, I was born in Sydney.

Is the AGIR/SPQR question be allowed to pass on or does it get to mean something?

Dear Yabby,

What results are the drones getting?

I can point to increases in Taliban numbers and bombings within Pakistan.

How do you think we should measure their success? Body count? That was tried in Vietnam.

What can you point to?

Can you understand why they have the belief that America in their culture is 'piss weak'?

I watched “Charlie Wilson's War' the other night starring Tom Hanks. Charlie Wilson was a US senator who found himself in the position to covertly funnel many millions of dollars of weapons to the Mujahdeen and was awarded for his part in helping bring down the Soviet empire. But who did the fighting and dying? It wasn't American troops, it was Afghan and Arab militant fighters. Can you blame them for thinking their sacrifices and bravery brought down a super power?

Those who know their history are aware there were many other things at play in the collapse of the USSR, but most don't.

Now another sign to bolster the myth that they are exceptional fighters is the fact that the Americans prefer to send unmanned drones to attack them rather than meeting them on the battlefield.

You said “Telling your enemy that you will under no circumstances use land mines, gives that enemy a clear advantage of not having to worry about mines in their planning. Hardly a clever thing to do. “

Are you implying Australia and the other signatories are not clever?

Cont...