HI all :)

well... some of you got lost in the mass of possibilities, but that's ok.

RawMustard is closest to the mark re the actual footage in contention.

Please excuse me for narrowing the focus here.. please examine the footage ONLY from about 2.01 to 3.. the following happens.

a) A policeman falls down (?)
b) Another policeman looks in his direction.

The contention is this "Was the policeman struck by a missile hurled by the crowd or.. did he trip over or get bitten by the dog"?

BELLY mate..it's not a 'test' it is a valuable example of how we perceive things. I've had quite a bit of back and forth with Pericles and he is adamant that his version took place.. I took a contrary view, but what those views are.. I'll withhold for now :)

Do you (Belly and OUG) see this?

//I opened it in a video editor and sure enough, frame by frame the cop trips over the dog as he steps backward.//

I think it must have been more than a mere trip because he was stretchered off to sick bay. The question is...'why' ?

The reason this is important is because this incident has been reported widely in the Left wing (ie mainstream) media as follows:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1319113/EDL-protest-turns-violent-Policeman-injured-missiles-hurled-Leicester.html

There is pretty much only ONE "impression" you could take away from such coverage..but let's look at some carefully cobbled sentences.

"But as EDL supporters gathered today, missiles were thrown(by whom?)at police officers who held the crowd back."

//"EDL protest turns violent".... "Policeman Injured"
"Missiles hurled" Leicester.//

Missiles here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4AFJ2EPTXg&feature=player_embedded

see 1.15 and onward.

I think you may be aware, you are digging a hole for yourself here, Boaz.

>>well... some of you got lost in the mass of possibilities, but that's ok.<<

That's a clear admission that the video is not entirely self-explanatory, is it not?

>> I've had quite a bit of back and forth with Pericles and he is adamant that his version took place.<<

And that's just a straight fib.

It was you who stated categorically:

>>TRUTH. 1/ Policeman bitten by police dog!<<

I simply pointed out that the evidence you presented was consistent with the policeman in question being hit by a missile. Given the fact that the video does not show either a dog-bite, or a missile landing, calling your version "TRUTH" is completely unjustified, wouldn't you agree?

It was clear from the start that you were not going to allow viewers to see the evidence without some additional Boaz "leading the witness" assistance.

>>According to one report the officer had an "injured leg" (how ?)<<

Your attempt to point the finger at the dog also backfired though, didn't it. As RawMustard observed...

>>...sure enough, frame by frame the cop trips over the dog as he steps backward<<

Falling backwards over a dog can easily lead to a leg injury. Try it yourself sometime.

>>...it's not a 'test' it is a valuable example of how we perceive things<<

Anyone watching that footage can draw their own conclusions, obviously. Which you have amply demonstrated here.

You (and the English Defence League) want it to show the way in which the police support anti-fascist demonstrators, as they oppose a peaceful group of patriots going about their lawful business.

To me, though, it shows that, hey ho, here we go, here's yet another group of soccer hooligans wrapping themselves in the flag of St George as an excuse to pick a fight with Muslims.

Incidentally, your description of the Daily Mail as "Left wing media" would have any passing Englishman in tears of laughter. It is the UK equivalent of calling Rupert Murdoch a purveyor of communist propaganda.

Here is my nancy drew quick explaination.

I by no means claim this is the truth but the pieces fit to me.

At 2:22 one cop dodges something and moves aside, the dog behind him is too far away to bite (plus he can't see from the back of his head)

Then the cop next to him falls down (quite possibly tripped over the dog) with an injured leg.

I find it improbable that the dog bit anyone, if you take notice you will see that the dogs are being held by the collar with their front paws off of the ground, this makes it impossible for them to lunge out and bite someone.

Then at 2:27 another cop skips backwards, clutches his arm and looks ahead, suggesting that he also was hit by something.

Just because the missiles weren't large doesn't mean they weren't thrown.

The case of the dog biting a fellow cop is unlikely to me, these dogs are highly trained for high intensity situations, their actions are command based and (as you can see) the dogs are restrained.

I base this on what I see in the film.

AL,
It would appear that the dog bit him but the vision is a little difficult to decipher as at the critical moment the officer is obstructed by another.
I get what you mean, as a boy i was taught that you only believe half of what you hear and quater of what you see, but which bits to believe?
The important thing i find is to not jump to conclusions about a situation until all the facts are known.

Just a quick afterthought, Boaz.

I believe you mentioned that the EDL and the Tea Party are having discussions. Here's an example of how close they have already become.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/10/woman-stomped-outside-rand-pau.html

I looked carefully at the video, in case there was a dog that crept up and bit her, but I couldnt see one.

But it all ended well. The guy doing the stomping has asked for an apology from the lady lying on the ground.

I expect he will also sue for the damage her ears inflicted on his boot.

Dear Participants.

This is good value in my view. Pericles..I will concede that any dog "bite" is not clearly visible. Remember now.. "frame by frame in a video editor" said RawMustard... 'frame'....by 'frame'.

In RM's view the policeman 'tripped over the dog'. That much at least is very clear to me..but it looks more like the dog 'dragged' him backwards which is why he lost his balance it seems.

NicNoto...I think you have the order wrong mate..the policeman who looks around..does so 'as' his cobber goes down. It appears that the policeman 'going down' actually collides with his mate on the way..causing him to look around with a "What the" response.

I notice the dog (which you previously did NOT notice Pericles) lurching forward... and the officer going down seems to do so in harmony with the dog lurching forward (actually just after the lurch, as you would expect if it had sunk it's teeth in and pulled)

In fact the

a) Dog (=canine covert EDL sleeper operative) lurches forward and.....(grabs officers leg?)
b) Officer 'turns' subsequent to dog lurch
c) Officer is dragged back and down.
d) Other officer in collision, he looks around.

Missiles are RARELY if ever hurled by the EDL.. but OFTEN and regularly by UAF.

But.. back to the topic :) If anyone can see any missile hurled you need to point out:
i) Some person in the crowd doing a 'throwing' action.
ii)An observable chunk of something on the ground or flying through the air..

Missiles are not hard to see flying through the air, but the physical action of the police are simply not.. repeat 'not' consistent with a 'missile hit'.

Is that my politics speaking or the facts ?