Yes AGiR,
I'm dumbfounded too.
Pelican says,
"Point me to any person of any faith who is inciting hatred,
violence, child abuse, wife abuse etc and I will take that on face value",
which is of course what you've just been doing but this has somehow
gone right past Pelican's beak.
"Cast not your pearls before swine" AGiR,
they are totally clueless.
BTW,
I was also tickled by CJ's boast of coming from a
"strong (postgraduate) background in textual analysis".
I think he probably meant textural analysis,
from his background as a graduate fence-post painter.

Proxy why don't you try coming at posts with an open mind and without any preconceptions. If you do you will see I was in fact acknowledging Al's point about the action rather than the word. But Al keeps pointing us to the texts so I feel I must, in the interests of fairness, seek to understand the Bible's teachings on similar topics.

Sorry it flew past you. At least I won't resort to calling you swine. Pigs are far too cute and actually quite intelligent.

Can't help but notice how you avoided commenting on certain Christian cults who are practising the 'literal' translation of the Bible.

People in glass houses....

Proxy - back under your rock.

Pelican - there is no point in engaging with Proxy. Under his various pseudonyms here he's proven to be nothing more than a troll.

Thanx Proxy :) but Pelly's beak has not yet pecked me too much...

Dear PELLY I was quite thankful for your last post. I don't mind such a discussion in the slightest.

A couple of accuracy points though... the Deuteronomy passage you cited actually is about punishing a MAN who slanders a woman (please look at it again)...

The actual passage you mean't to quote is from verse 20 onward.
Yes.. it is very very blunt and horrific. The point which you as an atheist will not likely grasp though..is that this has nothing to do with 'Christianity' in terms of example or command or permission.

This is MOST important. I cannot sufficiently emphasize this because it is crucual to understanding this kind of issue. Let me bullet point it.

1/ Deuteronomny was the 'contractual' document for the covenant between Yahweh..God (Suzerain) and Israel (vassal) there were rules by which they were expected to live in the social law side of tribal/national life. This was 'Israel specific'.

2/ No Christian who understands the relationship between the Old Testament and the new.. would ever advocate such 'stoning of non virgins' today.. because there is no theological requirement for it.
For your information, please read the following verses if you don't mind.

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Acts+15&version=NIV

Verse 1-29 please please...take the time to read this as it is most crucial for this discussion. If you have questions after.. run them by me and I'll do what I can to engage.

Let me ask please..IF.. you can find a mainstream Christian commentator who DOES advocate such things.. feel free to present it here :)

THAT....is the crucial difference between the issue I've raised re Islam and Christianity.

Now.. (hope ur still reading :).. you said this:

//Point me to any person of any faith who is inciting hatred, violence, child abuse, wife abuse etc//

Please see next post for the response there...kind thanx.

PELLY..continued.

To respond to your request..

//Point me to any person of any faith who is inciting hatred, violence, child abuse, wife abuse etc and I will take that on face value,//

Actually.. that's the whole reason I make a fuss about this type of stuff.. though I've been less direct lately.. trying to move more to discussion as we are having now than the 'shotgun' approach :)

Wife beating...for the here and now:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/its-ok-to-hit-your-wife/story-e6frf7l6-1111118628963

In a recorded lecture entitled "The Keys to a Successful Marriage", delivered to his male worshippers but now broadcast on the internet and viewed by several thousand people, Mr Hamza said Islamic law allowed men to hit their wives as a last resort, but they were not to make them bleed or become bruised.

COMMENT ..this is in perfect harmony with the Quran.. and here this bloke is permitting/promoting it.. in 2009 (actually his lecture was a few years back.. must have been a slow news day for the HeraldSun :)

But the lecture is there... he was not denying his words.. how could he..the Quran permits it in black and white...for all time..(key issue)
Here is the verse
http://www.ummah.net/what-is-islam/quran/noble/nobe004.htm see v 34

There are countless vids on youtube of senior Muslims explaining about this for the here and now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWGA8i6scYY

CHILD ABUSE (they don't cal it that...they call it 'doing what Allah has permitted)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SfUKGp4iMg

go straight to 7:50 to save time...and there...you have it :)

"But it remains legitimate...... if a Muslim man in his 50s even today..wanted to marry a 'young woman' of 9 or 10 .etc"

this man..who was invited to speak to Melbournes Islamic community as a 'respected sheikh' was denied entry..but not on the grounds of this thinking (the vid) but for his alleged connections with groups who might constitute a national security threat.

So...there you have it :) finally.. and my point of course is this.
Should we as a nation be facilitating, appeasing, welcoming, nourishing such a value system which is so darkly disconnected from ours?

Are you still beating your daughter, Boazy?