Foxy,
Why single out muslims as a group, why not Hindus, jews, christians or atheists.

You are implying that muslims make a positive contribution simply by being muslim.

You quote the Afghan cammeleers and were they all muslim or in fact Afghans? One could single out the contribution of 'Injun' hawkers, who provided a valuble service to isolated selectors and homesteaders, but were they all Hindu and were they all Indian?

I suppose one could denigrate the muslim Afghan cameleers for letting the camels loose, when they were of no further use, and creating the enviromental problem we now have in our deserts. Equally we could blame the religion of the person who introduced rabbits for causing a massive problem.

The facts are that many individuals have, and still do, make possitive, and negative, contributions to our society and that religion has nothing to do with it.

But there are certain groups that refuse to give up alien cultural practices, which are adverse to our society, and I believe we should stop importing those groups.

I'm beginning to sound like a broken
record here - but once again - Thanks
to everyone who's contributed positively
to the thread.

The Forum Rules state quite clearly:

1) Keep responses on topic.
2) Do not flame.
3) Do not post the same messages across
multiple threads.
4) Observe ... defamation laws.

And so forth.

As I've stated previously there is free speech
and then there is hate inducing vilification.

Once again I recommend you all take a look at
the following website:

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=2893

Especially scroll down to the post by one BOAZ_David
in the comment section of this website where he makes
allowances for the actions and behaviour
of certain Christians, (we have to understand why
they did what they did),
but he's not willing to do the same for the actions
of certain Muslims. Double standard? You betcha!
(He goes under the name of ALGOREisRICH at present).

And as for Proxy, well he's never insulted a Muslim -
so he claims. Yet read what he has to say on our
positive Muslim contributor by the name of "Grateful."

As another poster pointed out - actions do indeed speak
louder than words. The thing that I've always loved
about this Forum has been the variety of conversations
taking place. However,some people lack the art of
conversation, but unfortunately not speech.

Dear Severin,

I agree with you wholeheartedly - Management should
do something. I'm surprised that Management has not been
sued for defamation by the Islamic Council - because
defamation of a religous group is a criminal offence.

Dear Banjo,

Kindly read my opening post
it explains the reasons for the
thread. And should make things
crystal clear to you.

Thanks Foxy

I'm feel validated for being understood, having made criticisms of management on OLO instead of privately (by email) and I was suspended.

Besides, how do you choose among the plethora of posts by the those who vilify Muslims? Perhaps, that is part of the strategy; make so many offensive posts that people give up. I admit to skimming AGIR (Boaz) - life is too short and I have far more positive ways to spend my time.

QUOTE

grateful

Thanks for your input. As an Atheist I am intrigued by those who go on to choose a religious path.

Most importanlty, Christianity and Islam seem not very far apart at all in the essentials -

"Be kind like me, be compassionate, love the poor and the destitute, be gentle, care and love your brothers and be protective."

ENDQUOTE
Pelican, thank-you for the kind words.

I think those who express fear or hatred to what they consider an "alien culture" are denying themselves the opportunity to understand their own culture, values or way of life.

To give an example: I once participated in a 2-day intensive in pastural care run by one of the major hospitals. Participating were Christians,Catholics, Jews, Muslims, Budhists and a couple of atheists. We were given different scenarios involving patients or relatives/friends in trauma, facing difficult choices or terminal illness, and asked how we would deal with each situation. We were also asked to discuss our respective traditions' approach to pasteral care.

I learned so much about my religion by listening and discussing how others applied their teachings to practical issues (notably Buddhist, who are always good value).

Perhaps some of the oppostion to a constructive dialogue on this and other posts reflects an 'identity crisis'. I'd just like these people to give it go, because I'm sure they'll find an opportunity to deepen and reinforse key Australian cultural traits such as "mateship" and "fair go".

An atheist would probably say "mateship" and "a fair go" are examples of how values which reinforse harmony and co-existance can evolve through human experience, without Divine intervention, whereas people such as myself would see them as evidence of our Creators compassion and guidance.

Whatever! We are both working for the same thing: a civilised environment to realise our potential and allow our children to do the same. We have every reason to be helping ourselves out particularly when the problems confronting us as a community are extremely challenging (consider, for example, binge-drinking, youth suicide, addiction to computer games, sexual violence, pedophilia).

Dear grateful,

We should judge people as we find them
and not make assumptions about them based
on our limited understandings of any given
ancient texts that these people may or may
not follow.

Fundamentalists exist in any religion and
it is unfortunate that Islamic fundamentalism
conjures up images of adulterers being stoned,
flogging executions, and in extreme cases, of
political fanaticism exemplified in aircraft
hijackings and terrorist bombings. This picture
is rather distorted, for it is based on what is
newsworthy rather than what is typical.

Your posts to this thread have helped a great deal,
and I Thank You for them. Muslims have contributed
to the Australian communities for decades, and I
have every faith that they shall continue to do so
for decades to come. They continue sharing community-
business partnership experiences with people like
Rob Hunt, CEO, Bendigo Bank.

Professor Abdullah Saeed is Professor and Head of the
Arabic and Islamic Studies Program at the wonderful
Sidney Myer Asia Centre, University of Melbourne.
He wrote the book, "Islam in Australia," which is worth
a read. As is the following website:

http://www.asiacentre.unimelb.edu.au/about/index.php

Which gives you an insight into the work the centre does.
If you're ever in Melbourne, it's worth a visit.