I feel STG that you do not like me.
That in no way stops me believing you are one of the best posters here, always have been.
But you are prone to lashing out , just as you did in that other thread, probably at me.
My ego is unharmed by criticism, I often see in my posts something not quite right.
But your belief is your right Davids is too, I share his view.
ALL religion is controlling, all of it must not let us think for ourselves.
And it strongly needs fears to exist, once man was frightened of the dark of rainbows and so very much.
Gods so very many of them came into our lives via our imaginations.
I have no reason to fear that, but every reason to dislike others who want freedom of religion stopping Dave and me asking for our rights, to not believe.

david f opens his opening post with the statement "I believe the Bible is wrong when it equates ‘lusting in one’s heart’ with actually doing something wrong.", and proceeds to speak of 'the seven deadly sins'.

The Wikipedia entry for the seven deadly sins (see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_deadly_sins#Biblical_Lists ), for what it may be worth, says, among other things, that:

"The identification and definition of the seven deadly sins over their history has been a fluid process and the idea of what each of the seven actually encompasses has evolved over time."

and;

"This process of change has been aided by the fact that the personality traits are not collectively referred to, in either a cohesive or codified manner, by the Bible itself ..."

I suspect the Wiki entry is substantially correct. The point of significance it makes is that it is not the Bible (whether that Bible be as accepted by Jews, or such with additions as variously accepted within the different strands of Christianity) that makes these assertions, but various religious traditions.

david f concludes with the statement "Religion can be a mechanism of control. Where it creates feelings of guilt for normal human reactions it is antihuman." Too right it can, and too right it is.

My only disagreement with david f's position is with his equating of religion with the Bible. It is my opinion that 'religion' has to a large extent been built upon straight-out misreadings or misunderstandings, as opposed to misinterpretations, of what, within its full context, is written about in the Bible. Such misunderstandings, perhaps deliberate, would seem to be the foundations upon which the control freaks, be they of extremist Jewish or Christian sects (including the biggest one), have commonly sought to build over the centuries with such devastating effect.

The infamous misunderstanding, in its context, of the words 'let him have it' (meaning 'surrender the weapon to the policeman') as meaning more colloquially 'shoot him', that once sent a young petty criminal to the gallows as an accessory to murder, illustrates my point.

Dear Forrest Gumpp.

Of course, I should not equate religion with the Bible. I should not equate religion with belief in God either. There are non-theistic religions such as Buddhism which do not mandate a belief in God. I also accept your point that Bible-based religions conflict because of various interpretations of the Bible or even ideas such as papal infallibility which have no Biblical sanction whatever. Bible based religions have different versions of the Bible. Jehovah's Witnesses have a version whose translators are not even made public so other Biblical scholars cannot question or discuss with them.

Dear StG and runner,

I regard the Bible in the same light as I regard other books. All books including the Bible were written by humans and are subject to questioning by other humans. StG has questioned blaming God for evil. Since I think God is a human invention I think it is ridiculous to blame God for anything. However, in the Bible God identifies himself as the source of evil.

From the King James Version Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

quote<<..I believe the Bible is wrong.....
when it equates..‘lusting in one’s heart’..with actually doing something wrong.>>...let those without sin not cast stones

as a precautionary measure...to reveal none is without sin...by this measure..if we thunk it..its in our heart...see lust as the active of envey

see the next realms have no such inhibition...we are free to lust ans envey till the cows come home...see that spirit laws are you think it ,...an lo behold it is...

just because we are nice here...dosnt mean there isnt sin in our heart...sure we seek to control it...now...but in the next life there are no secrets...what we think..is wrote large on our faces..for all to see...so best to learn..not to even think it now

but were not perfect...we can only lust after that we lust for...find out why the lust now/here..or why the envey...its not our lust or envey...it belongs to the one lusted...think of it as stealing..from the one lusted after...less lust means more trust

<<The Seven Deadly Sins are Pride,>>..as previous respondants have explained...racial pride is very destructive..it often leads to rightious...lol..<<Wrath,>>...based on fear rooted in<<Envy,>>bigitry

envey fear hatred into to Lust,..for revenge..even if only >>in ones heart,...in the next realm..leads to spi-ritual<<Gluttony, Avarice and Sloth....hell

<<The first four name feelings>>..warning signs...its best to avoid<<...The last three describe behaviour..>>it strikes me that pride/full..wrath-full..[fearfull]..slothfull..are proper words..

but rightious-full..envey full...averise full...gluttonyfull..are not

<<Behaviour can be condemned.>>but by our deeds will we be known...in this realm...by our thoughts in the next...we are preparing for the next realm

<<However,..wrath at injustice>>>..sees a man finding reason to be doing ill to others..so a man thinketh in his heart he seeks to do,

<<envy in feeling we have been or are being deprived..lol..in some way..when it is merely the luck of the game..that somebody else has some thing..you desire...<<and lust are merely normal human emotions.>>..to desire is human..to lust is an obsession

<<It is unreasonable to regard a normal feeling as a sin.>>.i fully agree...feelings are divergent of passion...god loves our passsion..just as we get joy from others..so too god love our passion

<<To do so creates unreasoning guilt>>..the angels have hundreds of guilts...or ways of dividing the goods..from the good..and the bads from the bad...so much so..that even as to what we think..

our thoughts attracts more of the feeders off those thoughts...and those spirits who would feed off them...see thought create enegy..thinking it in our heart creates it in heaven[and hell]...sends in a root..that ties us into the darknes or the light..each good has its fruit...so too each not good

<<There is enough actual wrong done..so one should not feel guilt when one has not done anything wrong.>>see how it works...you think evil..good cant come near...you think good..evil cant come near...

see if good is here...only you can push it away..by thinking of vile evil..cccrapp..know much more is given..than we are aware of...our mindset...sets up light..or darkness...yes im a sinner..yes i have tasted some of the sins of the flesh...

but in those times..we must realise were playing with fire/demons..who have the same passions..get energy from our negative thoughts...and will in time claim their own...certainly we shall meet..in that lust place...but its allready rooted into our heart

<<a person can feel..it is no more wrong..to act on..the feeling than to merely have it>>.straw clutching david...by our deeds will we be revealed..in this realm..our feelings/thought...create the next

<<Religion creates feelings..of guilt for normal human reactions..it is antihuman.>>..only god is perfect,..but see how evil LOVES its vile/passions...much more than the do gooder/passions..does its good

Belly,

Don't not like you. Don't know you, so I can't not like you. What we see of each other here is a one dimensional view. There's more to me than what you read and I'm 100% sure the same can be said for you.

The people like davidf look at religion is like how someone would look vehicles by describing the engine. A car isn't just an engine. But he wouldn't know because he believes - (and refuses to budge from that POV because it may end in some understanding which ISN'T what he wants) - that the bible is religion and faith summised, in text.

I've read the bible, but I don't trust the content as whole because of almost guarantee that MAN has altered the content for personal gain. You also don't find faith in the bible, you find guidance and read about others experiences of faith in it.

I don't go to church. It is run by man, and man is flawed. A church is full to over flowing with hypocrites.

I believe there's a place for abortion in our society. I don't agree with 'lifestyle abortions' as there are millions of couples who can't have children naturally and would benefit greatly from someone elses unwanted child. I believe there's a place for genetic testing and screening. My partner has Cystic Fibrosis and I wouldn't wish that on anyone.

I bet my basic life philosophy really isn't that much different to yours, Belly. I'm sure if we lived next door to each other you'd treat me the way you'd want to be treated and I'd do the same in regards to you. But the diference between you and me is that I thank MY God for the existance I was given.

Do I deserve to be ridiculed for living that way?. This is the sort of stuff people like davidf refuse to understand or comprehend because of the blinders he wheres for whatever reason but covers that truth with smoke and mirrors.

Yeah, I spark off Belly, but that's my only flaw. ;o)