Pericles.

So you consistently attack us yet now admit you don’t know our policies.

Say’s it all really. See our policies here. http://www.livexports.com/

What I personally think, feel, does not come into it.

It’s what has to be done.. and it must be done on a large scale.

We need control of the industry.

From there we improve conditions.

No more long haulage!

Cattle drive to plants (working with regional and aboriginal people) JOBS. Making this a currciculum for schools and touisim.

Tourism brings people. People are independent witnesses.

Naturally the Government will be requested to have RSPCA Inspectors present (tourism being so important to them….).....

Col Rouge, You made a good contribution on the RSPCA puppy thread and I’d encourage anybody to do what they can for animals. Thank You.

Bronwyn, you’re correct.
Pls, share what it is you don’t like about our projects and we welcome your ideas also. Are you opposed to people eating meat- or is there something else you don’t like about PALE. Feel free to raise any issues.

.* There is no 'bitchiness' within the animal advocacy movement beyond one group. Everyone else involved in a meaningful way works in complete harmony. Nicky
Posted by Nicky, Monday, 26 January 2009 11:44:39 PM*

I may be 'forced' to address this. Perhaps in hindsite it should have been 6 years ago. I had just hoped we could bring an end to twenty years of inta fighting. IMO as long as one particular person who`s sat in a top postion for twenty years or so remains - thats not possible.

Some tactics have been used are 'so horrid' the main other concern has been that it might take attention away from the Animals.

Yabby said he thought it was about funds. Well its not about funds for Gertrude and her mob that’s for sure, However he `s made me think and realise I have been naïve.

It never occurred to me TBO I just thought it was political games and personal egos.

After saying that I do understand people need funds to pay advertising costs.

Now is not the time to get paranoid, PALE&IF.

>>Pericles. So you consistently attack us yet now admit you don’t know our policies.<<

Attack your organization (I assume that's the "us")?

Not at all.

I expressed my opinions on the apparent dichotomy between what "you" say and what "you" do, on the assumption that there was actually a real person behind the headline.

>>What I personally think, feel, does not come into it.<<

Now you tell me that you are merely articulating policy. Fair enough. But that is new information.

So let's try again.

First of all, there is absolutely no need for me to acquaint myself with your "policies", as I have no argument with the organization that you represent. I'm sure that you do wonderful work on behalf of whoever is is that you work on behalf of.

My own views and opinions do not belong to or reflect an organization. If they are offensive to your organization, so be it. But they are not an attack. They are merely personal views and opinions.

But now I am even more intrigued. From your protestation that your personal feelings "don't come into it" I have to assume that they differ from those of your organization. Otherwise there would be no point in revealing them.

So do tell. Just between us girls. What do you really, really think about keeping pets?

Are you really comfortable with the idea of perpetuating the enslavement of animals for the personal amusement of humans? And do you really feel that there is no conflict between your organization's drive to stop people being cruel to animals, and your personal decision to deprive animals of their liberty?

You can answer as a real person if you like.

I would like to add the best animal advocaat
over the years imo on OLO would
have to have been Celiva.
A main stream person with
intelligence and courtesy.

I note she has commented on this thread but as usual pretty much ignored.

Many others in the past.
Free Ranger full of information
and done more than anybody else
on this earth!

Who can forget PF-
Again so full of knowledge.
I considered it a victory for animals
and a step I the right direction when
finally she was respected.

Mind you not respected enough to support her threads.

We lost Scout, Robert and at least
a dozen others. Animal Welfare threads
'used to be the largest on OLO.



IMO the inta fighting and straight
out attacks at PALE have been organised
to discredit our organisation in the same
way it’s been done off the net.

The mind set has been GET PALE.
Now I don’t know why so called Animal
Lovers would want to stop anybody from
also trying to help animals.
To me its beyond the PALE.

* This started WELL before HKM was even thought of.*

Back then we were told it was because we were working in conjunction with RSPCA QLD

Dicky Nicky + PALE agreed
not to address each other.

. I ask everybody to try to understand them.

You have no idea what’s its
like to feel useless. To lay awake
at night with the images from the
latest pictures you have received.

They are not to be condemned for
their understanding a love of Animals.
There are not enough people on
earth with these principles.

We plea with 'everybody' to just keep the animals as the number one priority because we have little time to make real changes for animals.

As the world seeks into depression Animals will be put even more to the bottom of the list. (If that’s possible.)

Please Write to Your Local Church, heads of Churches and Senator Feilding and speak up for our fellow creatures- this we be beg you .

Mercury for all Animals

PALEIF

"Bronwyn, you’re correct. Pls, share what it is you don’t like about our projects and we welcome your ideas also. Are you opposed to people eating meat- or is there something else you don’t like about PALE. Feel free to raise any issues."

I'm not across the policies of PALEIF or any other animal welfare organization enough to comment on them, and I really don't wish to be in a big way. I will leave that to the more dedicated such as yourself.

My interest is really just in following the debate as it unfolds here on OLO. I'm actually a meat eater myself, and despite what Dickie says on the subject, do firmly believe it is my best and only health option right at this stage of my life. I am very much persuaded, however, by Dickie and Nicky's arguments about the damage that large scale meat eating dependency is doing to the planet. It's part of the reason I eventually intend to reduce my meat consumption and even now am attempting to do so.

I'm also persuaded by your view that meat eating is with us to stay, at least for the foreseeable future, and that our efforts should be concentrated on alleviating suffering within the industry. I have sympathy for both positions.

What I don't have sympathy for is the bickering between you that occurs on these threads. It is a turn off and I'm sure as you've surmised it has deterred many posters from persisting in these threads. I'm not talking about the bickering between Nicky and Dickie and Yabby which I actually find quite amusing as well as informative, but that between you and the two girls.

PALEIF (Cont.)

In particular, seeing as you asked for my views, I find you can be obtuse, very 'in-shop' and all-over-the-shop at times in a way I don't find with the other two. Having said that, I know your heart's in the right place and that you're doing what you see as right and for the right reasons. I also like the way you attempt to bring the rest of us into the debate.

On balance, I wouldn't persist with these threads if I didn't believe the informative and entertainment value didn't outweigh the drawbacks, which for me at least it does. So keep up the great work all of you.

And just remember, PALEIF, it is the Yabby's of the world who are the real threat to animal rights, not Nicky or Dickie.

I sort of agree with Bronwyn here.

Also I would like to stress that pretty much all animal welfare go out of their way to co operate, there are 2 orgs that I notice are, at times just too ideologically at odds with the broader animal welfare movement and that is PETA(extremism) and RSPCA(to lax on animal industry standards), but that is pretty much all and not to the extent that members of any group would bicker enough to not be able to co-operate if needed for an animal.

PALE I have never heard of as an org but for on OLO here.