Paul.L,

I'll give you a hint. Take everything you've said about me then look in the mirror. You'll see a strong correlation there, I think.

When the only way you can make your point is to do so at a hundred miles an hour and deliberately distort what someone is trying to say, it shows you are the one who doesn't have a clue and is winging it big time.

Now, would you like to address the points and explanations I made in my posts? Don't you think it makes sense to take the path of minimal harm in any given situation? Don't you think it's suss that the cops had to fire so many bullets?

Did you hear about the incident that occurred today where a woman who was involved in a domestic incident was shot by a young constable and even the person she attacked said that she was running AWAY from the cops at the time and that the constable panicked? Do you know how this was reported? That the woman was waving a knife implying she was threatening the police. The man says it was actualy a fork. Don't you ever think the cops might not be telling the full truth in the dissembling that goes on in their media unit? Do you fully think an issue through at all?

One thing that's been skimmed over here is the fact that Victoria Police have a tradition of " ...fatally shooting members of the public (both innocent and guilty) at a rate exceeding that of all other Australian police forces combined ".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Police#Recent_history_-_controversy_and_corruption_allegations

Maybe things have improved under Christine Nixon, but I wouldn't be looking at police in Victoria as shining exemplars for any police service. Yes, I agree that polioe need to be able to respond effectively to deranged people brandishing knives, but the Victorian case of 10 shots into a teenage kid has to be seen as excessive.

Paul.L's pronouncements on police operational tactics are as usual strident, and are consistent with his armchair general approach to other issues. You know - shoot first, ask questions later, and all that hairy-chested stuff.

This post may well be dead and buried but I will add to it anyway.

I think you are all missing the real point here.

If we had a world without criminals, without lunnies, without druggies and without thuggs, our police would be armed with a note book and perhaps a digital camera.

Remember, 40 years ago, before the do-gooders became a force, we almost had a world like this.

Perhaps we need to re-visit the world where disciplin starts at home and is carried on at schools and workplaces. At least then we may see a return to a time when children respected their elders and police can go to work without the fear of perhaps not returning.

Belly, Col Rouge and Kartiya Jim, you are all absolutely right, of course. The events you have quoted here are quite horrifying, and demonstrate that there are good and bad people to be found in every occupation, and the police force is no different. I have worked as an Education Officer in prisons, and believe me, some of the inmates were infinitely nicer people than some of the custodial officers (and the prison management).

There is an undoubted gap and systemic failure in mental health services, and I think that is because they are not "vote winners", and this leads to and corresponds with deficits in Justice/Corrections systems as a whole.

You have to feel sad for this boy's family. According to reports I read his mother had contacted the police because she believed he was out of control. And reports about Victoria Police in this action, and systemic corruption in the ranks are a cause for serious concern. On the face of it it DOES look like "excessive force" was used, but none of us was there and didn't see the incident. It's easy to make judgments - either way - without having the perspective to do so. How much training in dealing with incidents like this did these officers have? Maybe I'm wrong about Tazer guns, but they can cause death too, and are certainly open to abuse (as I've seen in prisons, along with some of the gas they use to quell riots, which often were not riots at all).

But capsicum spray appears to be pretty useless and that leaves these guys with little with which to defend themselves.

I guess I'm saying we should all try to keep an open mind until more facts emerge.

Nicky

Rob P,

you say >> "I'll give you a hint. Take everything you've said about me then look in the mirror. You'll see a strong correlation there, I think."

What are you a teenage girl?

You avoided discussing ANY of the facts I introduced into this argument. Instead you have decided to change the focus of the discussion.

I have a simple point. You weren't there and therefore you have no place condemning the police for their actions. Wait for the coroners report.

CJ, The mouthpiece of PC.

I see that you have again decided to bait me, instead of argue with me. We all know that I would wipe the floor with you. I'm not alone in that, most of us can. So I'm not surprised you avoid any serious discussion of a subject.

You're like that little barking dog that stays on his side of the fence. Very brave

Maybe I've misjudged you. Maybe you aren't afraid, maybe you're just incapable and trite one-liners is the most you can offer.

So Paul - I note that you don't acknowledge the Victoria Police's woeful record of "fatally shooting members of the public (both innocent and guilty) at a rate exceeding that of all other Australian police forces combined". According to your armchair expertise, that's not relevant to the discussion?

As for your claim that you could "wipe the floor with (me)", thanks for illustrating my point about your hairy-chested belligerence. Now perhaps you could go back to painting the "Warhammer" figurines you got from Santa.