“If you think the government must protect the whole society”

Government protects the interests of the individual people who vote in elections.

“You are from the other site, from the losers side”

Ah the losers who managed the economic abundance of the last decade to produce multi-billion dollar government surpluses and overcame the debt ridden incompetence of the Keating and Hawke governments multi-billiion dollar government inflationary debts.

Krudd has all the hallmarks of a one term government, especially when people associate him with the forthcoming recession.

“I do not care for business for the business at all. I could live on a tree or in a cave,”

Obviously other people “employment prospects” are at serious risk.

Of course, no employment, no need for maternity leave.

Living in a cave offers little attraction to me, I aspire to and work for better.

“My income is low I must improve it, my only way is to start some kind of my own business.”

I have run my own businesses for the past 20 years, maybe if you listened more you might pick up a tip or two (secret – it starts with “attitude”)

“If I have to die for them I WILL DO,” that is your right.
My right is to die for mine too but I prefer to live free and to be able to encourage self-reliance in others.

Self-reliance is the reward (as well as the path) which pays for itself through self growth and fulfillment as well as enrichment.

It is far better a path to follow than the levelers mediocrity of collective socialism, not just for the "self-reliant" individual but for all those who decide to follow the example.

Ultimately, "socialism" just describes the first (base) level on Maslows hierarchy. I suggest you find out about it.

Celivia “The majority of people, despite their differences in every facet of life, have raised wonderful, responsible children.”

I have never suggested otherwise C.

All those wonderful people are the ones who are taxed, denying them of their own resources needed for their own children, to support the irresponsible peoples children and there is a limit to that institutional benevolence.

“the woman misses out on future income, superannuation, while she is dependent on the income of her husband.”

You miss the point entirely

“She” or “he” does not matter, it is their “union” of being a couple (hopefully in marriage if children are involved) which they both chose and which they both share.

His or her individual finances are superseded by their joint income, expenses, assets and liabilities.

Re the shortcomings of the education system, write to the labor controlled government minister in your state. The rest,
I have no problem with free contraception (better than unwanted children who will become neglected and likely future neglectors).
you already know my views on abortion.

“Children are our future; therefore we can invest in the future if we invest in children.”

I did that as an individual through my own children. However, it is subject to the law of diminishing returns, like all economic activity.

Col Rouge

The society, the community is on the top, individuals are part from the community, part from the society. The importance (positive or negative)of each individual increased as we are moving from the big societies to the smaller one. The importance of each individual (for him self) is in its highest level when the individual feels and behaves as a selfish individual, ignoring the conditions,needs, goals and dreams from his society, from his community.
The society, community, is stronger when it has many members, many individuals and when the individuals feel as part of the society, community and act according to the general directions, needs, goals and dreams of their society, community. If the individuals distance their self from their community, from their society THEN THEIR SOCIETY,THEIR COMMUNITY HAS NO FUTURE. Many individuals speak against their community or even do not recognize the existence from their community, society but all these are empty, words. IN FACT THEY CONTINUE TO ACT WITHIN THEIR COMMUNITY, WITHIN THEIR SOCIETY.
Always there is a distance between individuals and their society, this distance become bigger as the conditions, goals, dreams, between the individuals are bigger. Big inequality and conflicts of interests between the individuals blocks the progress from their society and sooner or later create problems for each individual, even to individuals with less dependency (as Col Rouge) from their society.
The best conditions for a society and its individual members is when there are the minimum conflicts between the society and individuals and when there is the minimum inequality between the members of a society, between its individuals.
Humanity has had many bad experiences from extreme conditions from systems which use the society and social benefits as an excuse to promote their own benefits, see communist countries or opposite in other systems in the name of individual's benefits used brutal inhuman ways as slavery, fascism, Nazism and in our days the NEO CONSERVATIVES who are ready to use or who used ways not compatible with our civilization.
continue
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide

"Government protects the interests of the individual people who vote in elections"
Government protects the interests from its country, from its society, from its community, protecting the general benefits also protects the benefits from individuals but in a deferent degree for each individual. I had to be idiots if I believed that Howard was protecting my benefits as Antonios, I do not think you believe that the government protects Col Rouge as individual, as you are part from Australia society, you benefited too.
What means "who voted on elections" What about the migrants who are not citizens? what about the hundreds thousands of British who did not become Australian citizens but they lived here for many decades? Australian ALP government can not and it does not discriminate against Australian citizens or Australian permanent residents, also protects the rights from tourists, temporary residents etc, even the rights from refugees and illegal migrants! I think you remember Howard's government, forget them! Howard did not elect even MP , Liberals popularity is under 6% and I think they need, 50-60 years to return back.
AS THE GOVERNMENT WILL PROTECT THE BENEFITS FROM AUSTRALIAN MOTHERS AND CHILDREN SIMULTANEOUSLY THE GOVERNMENT WILL PROTECT YOUR BENEFITS TOO, EVEN IF YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND OR DISAGREE WITH IT.
Antonios Symeonakis
Adelaide

“The society, the community is on the top, individuals are part from the community, part from the society.”

That is what is wrong with your philosophy.

The individual is paramount because it is only the individual who innovates, invents, inspires, improves the products, processes and services which are used potentially by all.

The only purpose of “society” is to support the individuals who comprise it.

A society based on “keeping all the same” will achieve relative mediocrity, compared to the collective of individuals.

A moral and energetic collection of individuals will achieve greater wealth, not only as individuals but with collective benefits for all.

Wealth in this context is not limited to the material wealth, which the lowest level of Maslow’s hierarchy fixates upon but the elevated levels.

“individuals feel as part of the society, community and act according to the general directions, needs, goals and dreams of their society,”

given choice, the individuals gravitate back to natural families of parents and children, regardless of the society, check the demise of Israeli kibbutz’s for evidence of that.

The direction, needs and goals are individually, not societally orientated and

“dreams”, no society has a “dream”, it only occasionally gets a dream of an individual politician inflicted upon it.

“NEO CONSERVATIVES who are ready to use or who used ways not compatible with our civilization.”

“Labeling politics” and pretending my views conform to your judgmental label is a cheap shot.

I believe in the sovereignty of the individual. I espouse that view consistently across a range of social platforms from abortion to national government. That you lack the vocabulary to describe it as anything other than “Neo Conservative” is up to you.

I voted Conservative in UK (Margaret Thatcher) and Liberal in Australia.

I am proud of how I have voted and know that my vote preserves my rights and your right to choice.

What you support is a system which ultimately leads to the horrors of a Lenin or a Stalin.

For that reason, you have a lot to learn from me and I have nothing to learn from you.

ASymeonakis
I think this debate is getting off track and onto politics.

The point is, while we are talking politics, that one only needs look at what a mess the state labour government has made of QLD. Boy did 'back flip beaty' know what was brewing when he pulled the pin.

We currently have in excess of 60,000 migrants (interstate that is) moving here per year and have done so for almost a decade now. These people, along with the rest of us have contibuted record amounts of taxes through GST, stamp duties, to name just a few and guess what?
We are officially IN-THE-RED!

This type of gross incompitence has been wide spead with many state labour governments failing on health, water and many other needs and, all this happens when they already know to some extent what thier revenue is going to be ahead of time.

I take great pride in the fact that I am in no way responsible for voting these fools in to power yet the downside is that I must to carry the burdon of thier collective incompitence. Bring on the next election and tell your lot not to tie themselves into any 'long term ' commitments.

Now back to the toppic.
As a business owner like col for some 20 years I can tell you quite simply, irrigardless of the numbers, that if the maternity leave is introduced women of child bearing age will suffer in the workforce.

Freindly advice that you can either take or leave but please DON'T-COMPLAIN if my prediction is right!