It seems quite obvious why unions are in decline and as why pale has kept saying.

Why send live animals overseas when we can have the jobs and the economical benifits that go with it.

It also makes a point about the union wanting the live export gone for australian jobs.

Now you might be fighting for those who work in the corner shop but then lets look at FP and them closing down shop as it is profit and uneconomical for them to keep operating here.

I also noticed that someone said it was wrong to place blame and also this included workchoices.

Was it not said from those here that work choices was bad, but now seems that some things that where said were untrue or just labor union spin.

So we know the unions and labor were heading for agreements that gave the worker the choice and this also included without unions help or looking over the shoulder so in all as they keep on saying that what howard did with the economy was due to keating policy.

Workchoices was also keating policy but didnt come about as the people were fed up with the recession we had to have.

The Nsw electricity sell off where are the unions. Is it not the workers who pay these people to represent them. No they are there for the business and the worker just gets suckered.

Oh by the way i had said lock in home loans well I did and i am already benefiting.

Stuart Ulrich

The strange claim that Paul Keiting supported or wanted workchoices is further evidence some do not understand the subject.
It comes from miss understanding the issue, PK in fact wanted GST, and maybe that leads to the mistake?
During the federal election in a seat we know of here in this forum signs warned voters to remember Witlams 17% interest rates? surely not? surely that was Paul?
OLO is in place as a place we can talk and debate issues.
It serves that purpose well.
Every one gets to have a say but can we debate? why have rules that are not obeyed?
I protest here about my self and understand it is human nature to push ones own barrow but surely this thread is no longer about its starting direction?
In a way we have been having our own 20/20 summit here from day one, and for many it is the only forum our voice can be heard in.
My love of my movements Labor and union are known.
My understanding both must grow, continue to improve is showing in my posts.
TAPP tells us both are wrong and that conservative Australia is too? what direction then mate do you want us to take?
Animal cruelty live exports growing meat exports and a self assurance I do not share drive those who are PALE to put far more value on their thoughts and far less on those they oppose a recipe for being twice beaten.
How do we debate issues without deliberately getting of subject? can we? is it better we do?
Is my defense of the thread as bad a sin as others? maybe yes I should just except that is the way it is we can debate very little without such rule breaking.

As you can see pale gave facts that a union said stop exports of live animals, but hey can labor and the other unions stand up and fight for that.

No

So when they stand up and fight for the workers and not the alp again then maybe the unions will gain some respect from some.

But what about Heiner, this has union all over the hiding of what happened and does this make for good unions No.

This says where unions allegiance is and it isnt the worker.

The Keating program for “ongoing reform” was set out in his “One Nation” statement issued on February 26 1992. Taking over many of the measures advocated in Fightback, One Nation’s goal was to drive up productivity and destroy conditions—won over decades—through enterprise agreements.

Hello Stuart
It good to see someone else other than us pointing out the utter unfairness and whats clearly political infearance which effects every person in Australia. Remembering we all pay taxes to support our raw materials being shipped out along with our nations future jobs.
Belly has a problem seperating debating facts and personal attacks.
On onther thread for eg he has put to us an offer If I call recall it correctly he said =

"PALE lets have a thread about live exports , while I may post there I undertake not to put unionism or Labor politics in it.
I will make no race related comments about anyone and talk only about why live animal exports will always be a part of Australian farming deal?"
Posted by Belly, Sunday, 20 April 2008 7:33:15 AM

Doesnt he know back then unions were 60% of the reason they statrted sending these poor creatures alive? Its been the biggest blow to Australia and we are going to see the full results in thenext four toten years if we dont wake up now and give these jobs back to Australia regional areas.

Know knowing how ALP come into it and of course the AMIUE being intructed to back off live Exports it does make it a bit hard to be only able to debate half of the issue.
However I have told Belly - Ok if it makes you happy.
The problem I think with Belly is he has no understanding of why the Governments support a small group of people within this cruel industry.
Remember somewhere in all of this our first reasonsibilty is to common deceny and human treatment of Animals.
We are not extreme as you call us or racist as you call us.

The RSPCA have just launced a protest at ALPs attitude to the cruel live exports however these industries who donate heavily to political parties also think they are immune to listening to the Animal Welfare authorites world wide. Stuart Pls Take a look at this RSPCA release=
http://www.handlewithcare.tv/au/index.asp
btw Good to see you back.

That signals the end of open debate on this issue in this thread at least.
It shouts about some not having the ability to understand the issue.
First week next month my voice and the voice of every union will scream at this[NSW] state leader at the ALP state conference.
We will tell him he has no mandate to sell our power, those who have an understanding of politics, even a very small knowledge know unions are sick of the man.
I am hugely amused at the thought it is claimed I have no understanding!
So ends another thread no one should be surprised it is not a rare event.

Well Belly the discussion was trade unions in decline.

what was given reasons why wether you like it or not.

So now you can go off and have a cry and have another read and you will find the lack of unions ability to stand and fight for the workers.

Stuart Ulrich