Then there's Fred Hollows, Philo. On his death, the Aboriginal, Vietnamese, Nepalese, Australian and Eritrean flags draped his coffin - a legacy of his good work during his time on Earth.

Now that's a man we can all admire.....a bawdy, tough human being whose desire to assist his fellow humans in need was truly ecumenical and performed without a belief in God.

Frank Hardy, who delivered the second eulogy at Fred's funeral underlined, in a dignified manner, that Fred was in fact a Marxist and a non-believer.

Philo
like the ones according to you that do no harm by sending Australias live Animals off in ships to those savage Muslims- According to you that in your own words on the other thread are so cruel.
Has it ever occured to you while you are bagging the Muslims for their treatment of Gods creatues that we the good Christians actually are the ones responsible because we send them- According to you?
Please dont give me that garbage again that Muslim require Animals Alive for Ritual Services philo We have shown you the oficial media R from muslim Leaders informing the public that is a lie and asking the media and government to at least tell the truth in reporting on live exports.
Is There A god?
Indeed Thats a question you so called good Christians and Church Leaders should think hard about before turning your back on Gods Creatures and putting the blame on the Muslims for goodness sake.

Another lurch away from the thread but let us move on I have not seen my questions about other Gods get much of a mention.
Have we the right to devalue others Gods?
Can it be true that of all mans Gods only the one you believe in is true?
Why?

Good questions Belly. But to the already-religious, the answer is self-evident.

Believing in a God is all about faith. Faith in the sense that you believe in something in spite of the lack of evidence for it - or to be more specific, the lack of evidence comprehensible to you.

Electricity is something that we are all familiar with. We "understand" that it does a heap of things, from lighting torches with a couple of AA batteries, to killing you if you touch the live rail in the London Underground. Very few people actually understand the process that causes these things to happen, but nevertheless observe that it acts in the same way, under the same conditions.

"Believing in" the power of electricity is an act of faith. We don't fully understand it, but we know that it exists.

Religionists have the same attitude. They have become convinced that the world cannot exist without there being a comprehensible underlying reason or rationale, and under the right conditions will decide that this missing piece is in fact a God.

But to reach that conclusion, it is far easier to concentrate on a specific manifestation of that God than just to say "God did it". The narrative needs a whole lot of back-story in order to be at all convincing, and each religion has its own version of this.

Once hooked on one particular version of this story, it becomes difficult to accept that a) it is just a story and b) there are many other stories that say the same thing.

The chances of the adherent of one religion accepting that another one of these stories might be "right" would undermine the entire foundation of their original belief, and exposure to that thought is therefore to be avoided. It would be like telling them "actually, they lied, electricity acts differently for different people - here, touch this..."

The bit that I don't fully understand is why it seems to give each religion the right to slag off the others. After all, they should all be on the same side, shouldn't they?

Pericles,

“If I were to tell you that the earth was at the centre of the universe, you would tell me I'm crazy ... In support of my arguments I would of course point you to the works of Plato, Aristotle, Ptolemy etc., who produced some compelling fictions, based upon what we now know to be a hollow lie.”

You have my attention. So what writings did Plato et al give that evidenced that the earth is the centre of the Universe and how does one witness that? I confess to a fairly skeptical nature.

You doubt the authenticity of Christian teachings. Surely they are the best historic record of the time available. Why would early Christians make up stories that would guarantee their execution and why eschew drunken debauchery for no reason? Martyring of early Christians was fairly routine and fornication is tempting to the flesh. What if they were telling the truth?

“The chances of the adherent of one religion accepting that another one of these stories might be "right" would undermine the entire foundation of their original belief, and exposure to that thought is therefore to be avoided. It would be like telling them "actually, they lied, electricity acts differently for different people - here, touch this..."”

Interesting. For people seeking the truth change seems possible if there is sufficiently compelling reason to change. People seem to convert within Christian denominations all the time.

”The bit that I don't fully understand is why it seems to give each religion the right to slag off the others. After all, they should all be on the same side, shouldn't they?”

Atheist fundamentalists seem to slag off more but to the exent that religious people do and it is a genuine attack not a defence I agree. This is particularly true within the same religion. However in practice, sadly, a lot of slagging goes on. The term shooting oneself in the foot comes to mind.

mjpb I have doubts you and I can agree on much on this thread.
I have however tried ,and I believe you have too not to be offensive to those who do not share my views.
Not fundamental anything, even ALP or union , I do however not believe in any God yet known to man.
I do want to point out some on both sides of this debate, not here in this thread condemn the other side.
Even claims of stupidity are often laid, My view is that is always wrong, often dogma driven and always wrong.
I will not concede evolution as Gods work, we could claim everything we like as such.
But in a world that has so many Gods, a post above gives good answers of why we do, it seems unwise to think a supreme being would only make himself known to some of us.
I am aware of some things we can not say, libel laws are harsh, but in the lifetimes of most who post here brand new religions have been born.
Shining new totally different Gods come to life.
More will follow you can bet on it.
5 or maybe ten generations from now may see more following one of those.
And just maybe a visitor from space may one day tell us of a far different God or that they have no God.
One day man will understand we will never truly understand, but locking our thoughts is unwise we should continue to ask questions of our selves.