Anticeptic, sarcasm is the lowest form of wit.

Anansi is right, there is NEVER any excuse to force anyone to have sex if they don't want to
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I wonder would you feel the same if you were flirting with a few women and they tied you up and forced you to engage in sex?
It is very rare indeed for this type of rape because of the usually physically stronger males.

There are some womaen who do falsely cry rape for whatever reason, however the numbers of these women would be few in comparison to the vast numbers who never officially report the rapes.

Thank God not all men feel like you, and thank God we have laws in this country outlawing rape of any sort.

Antiseptic,
I am also raising two teenage daughters and am aware of the difficulties in the gender/sex divide and the pressures of modern society.

Flirting is a natural part of the learning process for young people and both boys and girls partake.

I cannot see a victim ever being responsible for a criminal act whether is rape or theft. A rape victim no more contributes to the offence through flirting than a person who leaves their wallet temporarily on a table, when it is stolen.

The person who commits the offence is 100% to blame for their actions - it is a criminal act. The only way we can reduce the incidence of rape is to adopt a position of no-tolerance.

What you call contributory behaviour is a cop out for the criminal. One should be able to leave their wallet on a table for a few minutes without it being stolen, but the victim is no more at 'fault' than the rape victim for flirting unawares in the vicinity of a criminal. Can you see a Judge declaring to set a thief free because he was tempted by an unattended wallet?

While some behaviour might be considered risky or foolish - such as getting drunk at a party with a group of drunken footballers, and as a mother I would deter my own children from these behaviours for their own safety is not the same as blame.

Pelican,

re: "The person who commits the offence is 100% to blame for their actions - it is a criminal act. The only way we can reduce the incidence of rape is to adopt a position of no-tolerance."

Whilst I agree with you maybe you should have told the jury who acquitted the stripper of the anal rape of the best man at the bucks night.

Re theft: in NSW it is illegal to leave your car locked and unattended: So that if a car that is left unlocked and unattended is stolen both the thief and the driver can be charged.

Whilst a victim of sexual assault is still a victim, my thoughts go back to the reasons for judgment in a major rape case in NSW.

Quoting the press who quoted the Judge:

He said the emergency call showed "what it really means to be a rape victim" and suggested that it be used in schools as part of a campaign to provide clear messages about sexual assault.

For boys, these would be that "forced sex of any kind . . . is not a game, or a prank, or a practical joke, or part of becoming or being a man".

"The high odds are that you will be found out, tracked down and sent to jail . . . then you will be as much at risk from others as your victim was at risk from you."

For girls, one message was to never get into a vehicle with any man they do not know or barely know.

"Do not let anyone tell you that there is anything glamorous, or exciting, or 'cool' in any other sense about risking sexual assault of any kind. Any kind of forced sex is dirty and degrading," he said.

Condemning rapists might make you look rightous, but it won't work as a complete solution to the rape problem. Many rape victims do-not say 'stop' or something equally unambiguous. Several do say stop, but it is amongst alot of other things that seem to indicate yes. Nina's solution is for boys to be taught to get an explicit 'yes'.

I believe that it says something troubling about the way we raise girls that many won't tell a male to stop raping them. If I was getting raped, I feel certain that I would have quite a bit to say.

In addition, far too often, males are rewarded for persisting after she says 'no'. Many females will eventually say yes after saying no a few times. This happens because she is indecisive or on a power trip. People are reluctant to critisise this behaviour, because they will get accused of suggesting that she deserved to get raped. Any discussion of the ethics of sex should include discussing this behaviour. Just don't trust Nina Furnell to include it.

Its amazing how murky human relationships can be, but considering the fact that something like 75% of human communication is non-verbal, it is surprising that human relationships are not more murky than they already are.

There are some interesting research into this subect, such as an investigation into female flirting (New Scientist) and "Getting that Female Glance"
http://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S1090513804000601

Discussions with female friends indicated that they did not like the above research.

Given that the vagaries of individual personal tastes, what is one women's sleazebag, is anothers knight in shining armour and behaviour that may have been once acceptable, can then become totally unacceptable.

I have seen where female bloggers have written that when their partner stops hitting on them, that they feel that their partner nolonger finds them attractive or is attracted to them.

Another problem occurs where some women see themselves as the source/cause of male desire.

I do support dougthebear about getting into vechiles or even going to someone's room. There is nothing wrong with educating people on how to stay out of situations, that they do not want to be involved in.

Conversely people should also be educated into how they can get what they want, but usually human behaviour hides the motive/desire.

Pelican:"One should be able to leave their wallet on a table for a few minutes without it being stolen, but the victim is no more at 'fault' than the rape victim for flirting unawares in the vicinity of a criminal. Can you see a Judge declaring to set a thief free because he was tempted by an unattended wallet?"

Well, he may take into account all of the circumstances, including the carelessness of thr wallet's owner in creating the circumstances for the crime to occur. As has been pointed out, failing to take proper steps to secure one's possessions is punishable in some jurisdictions and can lead to insurers declining claims, even declining to insure.

Besides, whether the thief is punished or not, the wallet is still gone.

Relying on the goodwill of others to safeguard our own possessions (including our sexual organs) is never going to work. While the number of potential offenders is small, it only takes one for the offence to occur, while for it not to, you require 100% goodwill from all those strangers.

All I am suggesting is that women similarly bear some responsibility for taking steps to ensure their own safety from the few men who might take advantage of them.

You say :"The only way we can reduce the incidence of rape is to adopt a position of no-tolerance."

We've had that position as Government policy for some decades now. Has the incidence of rape declined?