Amazing how a church of Christ Minister (or should I say ex) can so deliberately mis represent the truth. What rot this man would of preached from the pulpit is anyone's guess. Thank God he is not in the ministry.

He obviously has little to do with his time. In the number of years that I have received the Australian Christian Lobby's newsletter their has never been a hint of racism. Mr Matheson can ridicule them for their anti abortion stand but his demonization is nothing short of dishonest. The head Pastor of Catch the Fire Ministries is coloured *and not white). He comes from an Islamic background so is far more qualified than most to speak on Islam. Their are plenty of non Christians that don't want any further Islamic immigration. Any fool could see it has been a failure in England, France and anywhere else they settle (never integrate ).

Mr Matheson seems to be a self appointed watchdog who deliberately speaks half truths in slandering some very decent people.

It is so much a shame that even the above threads who appear trying to postulate the so-called Aussie give it a go theme, appear to have no time for Islam.

However, with what the US professor Andrew Bracevitch recently stated in our WA West', that the US Age of Triumphalism is now over, we might have to be more honestly shameful and come out with a few admittances about white Western colonialism et al, et al.

To be sure we must admit, that while we may easily forget about the terrors caused by us in occupied lands in our colonial past, maybe we should take a lesson from the Sermon on Mount, where Love Your Enemy simply means to put ourselves mentally in the minds of the countless enemies us Conquistadors have made in the last three hundred years.

So once again from us Bleeding Hearts comes the suggestion for us to get together with even the Moslems, not so much with the unlovely Libertinian theme of the Western Way - mostly American - but to be historically truthfully honest in an effort to causally share the blame even with the worst of the terrorists

Bushbred -- and where have you been the last 20 years? There has been no shortage of admittances about "white Western colonialism" and violence. It happened. We recognize it.

Now, please tell me where I can find Muslims that will condemn Islamic hate and violence. Show me Muslim websites that discuss and condemn 1300+ years of jihad against non-Muslims. Tell me where I can find serious Muslim discussions of the Quranic texts that mandate violence against infidels. Please give me some links to Muslim discussions of all those special privileges that Mohammad gave to himself in the Quran.

Yes, honesty is the only way, but it has been a very one-sided conversation. I look at Islam and I see no self-criticism, I see no remorse for evil, I see no honesty.

I have quite a bit of experience with Muslims and the news is not good. They are not honest about their religion, about the situation of Islamic societies and, of course, the words and deeds of their dear prophet.

Understand that the West is confronted by a nihilism and deceitfulness so total that it is beyond comprehension and unredeemable. Muslims lie about their religion and its writings without shame. They lie about what the Quran says. They lie about their attitudes. At best, they are in denial - at worst they are dishonest. In any case they cannot be trusted with your life and freedoms and those of your family.

Bushbred, you and Matheson, by your denial, contribute to the pain, suffering and death this vile ideology brings to society.

I see no point in further debate at this time, so I will end this with a simple question for you, Mr Bushbred: Do you see any reason to believe or respect people that say "Praise be unto him" after the name of a person that did this
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/abudawud/038.sat.html#038.4348
or this
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/muslim/019.4345
or this
http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/082.sbt.html

A simple "yes" or "No" will suffice.

Kactuz

It seems, Kaktuz, that you do not understand what the old historical term Sharing the Blame actually means.

Cetainly you will find the answer in any university library, and more easiy, might be b a good idea to try Google.

Cheers, BB, Buntine, WA.

bushbred, i admire your gentle manner in response to these idiots. (i admire it but i can't replicate it).

" ... worldwide Muslim community about their hatred and violence against nonMuslims".

There's only one sort of irrational generalised bigotry and hatred I can see on display and it's in statements like that.

It's the same sort of thinking that demands "final solutions" because there can be no alternative. New Nazis indeed.

What then must we think of the world-wide Christian, Buddhist or Jewish communities?

Are they all, without exception - Sweetness and Light or should we label each group on the basis of those extremist elements that exist in each?