Veronika,
For about 99.99% of human history, there have been no condoms. So what did people do to contain STD’s?

Most species of animals also get STD’s, so what do most species of animals do to reduce the risk of STD’s?

If you have ever had experience in trying to get people to wear personal protective equipment, then you begin to think of something better than personal protective equipment to eliminate risks. Sometimes personal protective equipment works for a short time, but eventually something better system has to be found.

There are plenty of condoms available in Australia, and they can be cheaply and easily obtained from a supermarket anytime someone does their shopping. But consider the family types in this country, who not only have the highest rates of STD’s, but also the highest rates of child abuse, poverty, drug taking, abortions, underage sex and teenage pregnancy.

Also consider the family types most admired by those who want to call themselves feminist (and please, don’t give me the mantra that feminists believe in equality).

Oh RObert, you’re too funny!
Bugger, Fractelle, there goes our plan to pickpocket from RObert’s “pocket full of condoms” .
Thanks CJ, I checked out Timkins and agree that HRS is his clone.

HRS,
” …has called the fetus a toe nail”
Not true. I just want to point out that it doesn’t make sense for you to say that feminists are denying that the foetus is human. I agree that if it has human DNA it’s human.

But ‘human’ merely means having human DNA, not the DNA of another species. There are no special rights for human DNA alone.
I just wanted to make clear to you that we lose DNA everyday. Our nails are merely an example of DNA, so is skin, ova, and sperm… it’s all human DNA, and we lose some of our DNA every day. Not to forget about the very many zygotes that are flushed down the loo every day.

So the DNA argument by itself is not valid as an argument against abortion.

Extinction of the feminists.
That's actually quite funny, HRS. Would make a good movie title.
There are over 6 billion people in the world, HRS- there is no danger of the human race becoming extinct because of abortion.
Wars, pollution, unsustainability are examples of a greater thread to the human species than abortion.
Women have always used contraception and abortion ever since ancient times. Parents also killed their newborns if they couldn’t provide for them. Killing newborns was not considered a crime.

If you were serious about preventing unwanted pregnancies, when are you going to admit that using condoms in combination with another form of contraception such as IUD or contraceptive pill is the most reliable way to prevent pregnancies? I never relied on one form of contraception only.
Do you agree with RObert et al that vasectomies should be more affordable?

Like Sancho, I wonder if you’re more concerned about the sexual behaviour of people than about preventing unwanted pregnancies, just like the pope and the other religious, unrealistic nutcases mentioned by Democritus and Veronika.

HRS, I'd assumed that you knew how they worked. What I don't understand is why yuou play that silly game rather than debating honestly. If you are a rebadged Timkins then I know that you are capable of better (quiet CJ). If you are Timkins then you are capable of adding well researched and thought through input to the debate rather than a constant stream of red hearings, unbalanced criticism and attacks on other posters.

Condoms are not perfect, if used properly they are good and most of te failures are usage failures rather than manufacturing faults.

I think most of us are supporting a multi-tier protection system. Equiping kids with the information they need to make healthy sexual choices including delaying sexual activity till they are better prepared for it and helping them to understand the risks.

I don't recall anybody here advocating bonking anybody who will say yes. If the stats are correct comprehensive sex education leads to kids delaying starting sexual activity, abstenance only education does not.

Be concerned about the risks of failure with contraception but if you ignore the failure rates for abstenance you are kidding yourself. If kids mess up on the abstenance bit to you then want them completely exposed to the risk of disease and or pregnancy or would you rather the extra layers of protection that come from appropriate use of contraception?

To focus only on the failure rates of contraception whilst ignoring the failure rates of abstenance is dishonest.

R0bert

HRS

You write "For about 99.99% of human history, there have been no condoms. So what did people do to contain STD’s?"

That's easy, they died.

Life for most of human history was short and brutal with life expectancies in the 30s. If this is how you would prefer to live, then please do so but leave the rest of us alone.

Robert,
There are minimal statistics being kept on abortion in Australia, so I wonder what they tell children about that during sex educations class.

“Now children, you have to become aware and loving. But don’t ask any questions about abortion, because its none of your business. So use your condoms and don’t ask questions”.

Shadow Minister,
If you are a fetus in an abortion clinic, life can be very short and brutal. It is now much safer to be a fetus in a test tube in an IVF clinic, and your mother has selected your father according to what has been written on a piece of paper.

Welcome to femworld. Step this way.

Well said, RObert and Shadow Minster.

HRS,
” It is now much safer to be a fetus in a test tube in an IVF clinic”
Actually, it would be quite hard to cram a 3-5cm foetus into a test tube. IVF clinics work with zygotes and blastocyst embryos, which are tiny clusters of cells, smaller in size than a pinhead.
About 3 in every 24 of such embryos survive, the rest are disposed of.

If you think being an embryo or foetus is risky, you’d hate to be a sperm!
Only one out of billions becomes a survivor, just like you and I.
Because ‘you’ won the race, the runner-up and millions of his mates were left to die. How did you feel about that?

”If you are a foetus in an abortion clinic…”
Just like when you were a sperm, you wouldn’t be aware of anything because you’d be at the stage where you don’t have, and never had, a developed nervous system and brain.

BTW, the right to information is a fundamental human right. Deliberately keeping children and teenagers from having access to information about their own body is denying them that right.

While we try to avoid car crashes, we still want to teach our kids to wear a seat belt in case we do end up in a crash, even if some of the seat belts may fail.

"comprehensive sex education leads to kids delaying starting sexual activity, abstenance only education does not."
I had some space left and wanted to use it wisely by repeating what RObert said in case you failed to notice it the first time.