The first people for patting themselves on the back for being moral and good are Christians. They are great aren't they? They say they are good so they must be. This is the logic of faith , the believer says god exists so god must exist , I say god makes my rules so you must abide by my rules. Certainly Howard and Rudd are slaves to the narrow Christian point of view. By the authority of saying something therefore it is so, no questions please.

Unfortunetely religion with authority is tyranny wether politically (there has never been a benevolent leader who had strong religious beliefs) or socially (the low position of women in the bible as an example and the poor excuses to try and interpret clear words into something post modernist to make the bible appear as pro female).
From the tyranny and violence of God to the exclusionism of Christ the bible in no way contains any good moral or ethical value. Pentecostal greed to Calvanist dictatorship witch burning and war mongering are products of the Bibles contents.
Faith cant be trusted because it has no foundation in truth indeed faith is a manifestation of bias and wants and so it is dangerous to mix with politics.

Surely in the 21st century we should have moved on from superstitions created to justify the power of fuedal kings. I will vote for Howard or Rudd if they prove their god exists, if not then I will write them off as just another one off with the fairies.

Time to be the Devil's Advocate, I see,

While I am a fervent critic of the capital 'C' Church, and Christians, I have nothing but admiration for many of the auxiliary christian NGO's like St. Vinnies and Caritas, among many others. While the Churches are interested in power, and Christians fighting their own demons in others, there is a lot of good work going on almost in spite of the capital 'C's. Some christians actually try to follow the Gospels, some try to live in Christ's image, and some spend their lives trying to carry on Christ's work in helping the disadvantaged.

Whether he was real, or a symbol created by people, I am moved by the philosophy of Christ. Of course he wasn't the son of God, but he may have been the son of Humanity. I see him as a revolutionary leader, the ultimate philosopher-king. What a beautiful image is the Prince of Peace, the opposite of the global Fuehrer (the Anti-Christ). His paradigm was born at the very time Rome was at its greatest after Caesar's heirs stole the Republic, when the difference between the Haves and the Havenots was at its peak. He led a Luther-King/Gandhian style revolt, mixed in with a communal lifestyle as the antidote to poverty; the world's first socialist? The Church made him the son of God, so they, as God's representatives, could subvert and squash his movement. This is probably their greatest crime, and that is saying something.

So while the Church, and Christians, still do their best to quell real christianity, the cat is out of the bag. The Gospels speak to all people of a better way, regardless of religious belief. Join together, share what we have, love peace, justice and deny the Powers any control over us. Turn the other cheek is not passive, but defiant. Stay together, resist the oppressors and the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth may just be possible.

"christian ethics". the arrogance and sanctimoniousness of these people is beyond belief. if you can't defend your moral values on general human principles then why should i give a damn? why should any rational or humane person be impressed by the basing of morality on the teachings of a mythical being?

if "christian morality" is becoming a stronger political force, it is simply the sign of pandering to arrogant superstitious nonsense. a nauseating article written by a nauseaing man, in support of a nauseating organisation, all dripping with that nauseating, self-satisfied christian smugness.

BUSHY.. man.. you do have some venom there don't you :)

Let me act as a mirror.....

"Those filthy unbelievers.. they all going to HELLLL and they absolutely deserve it.. disgusting lot.. immoral, cheap, promiscuous, yes indeedy.. the scummy evil non Christians will get everything they deserve.. hell and an eternal fire to roast them..over and over....and as soon as we get 'power' we will be stoning them for the slightest reason"

Now...THAT is nauseating.... and totally 'un'Biblical in its tone and mood.. but that is also the tone and mood of your post regarding Christians.. not a good look is it ?

The harshest I'll say about unbelievers is that they are outside of Christ-lost, have no moral or spiritual anchor, and are in need of Divine Grace.... Why not see how Jesus describes those outside of Christ ?

"Sheep without a Shepherd"... what is to characterize believers ? "As the Father sent me, so I send you" (with the same love)

"For God so LOVED the world, that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes in Him may not perish, but have everlasting life"

The only people who perish, are those who WANT to....

It's all about choice. But your problem seems to be that you would deny Christians their democratic rights.. yet allow humanists and secularists theirs. That my friend is discrimination. We Christians take GREAT exception to many ideas and laws which humanists would make.. but we have to live with them in a democratic society.. so too, if those who follow Christ have enough votes... non Christians also must live with the outcome.... if they don't like it, they can do what we do.. EVANGELISE.. proclaim.. refute.. rebutt, debate, share... and try to build up their political base and CHANGE it.....

Freedom means we are ALL free to do just that.

oh, knock it off. i'm not denying anyone their democratic rights. i'm not suggesting christian groups cannot or should not lobby for what they believe. but that doesn't make these groups any less ridiculous or nauseating, or the pandering to them less ridiculous or nauseating

Boazy: "...if they don't like it, they can do what we do.. EVANGELISE.. proclaim.. refute.. rebutt, debate, share... and try to build up their political base and CHANGE it.....

Freedom means we are ALL free to do just that."

Does this mean we can look forward to Boazy ceasing his endless bleating about e.g. Muslims and their supposed political aspirations?

Somehow, I doubt it.