Roy writes
'The problem I have with the political Christian right is that they think they can legislate righteousness. Jesus taught that the best policy was example, tolerance, love, and authenticity. He taught to shun the accumulation of money and wealth, to focus our attention on the poor and needy, and to be the servant of all.'

I have sympathy with this stand Roy however it can be used as a cop out when we know the secular humanist are not happy to teach their own the lies of evolution and the denial of a baby being a baby but want the whole of society to participate in their own bigotry. It is true that their is no righteousness outside of Christ but it is also true that if Christians don't make a stand for the most vulnerable in society (elderly, unborn and children) then no one will.

AS was seen in Victoria that the secular humanist want free speech for everyone except Christians. I personally would prefer to go to jail then deny my Saviour and His teachings. I would like to think that my children will still have freedom to call wrong wrong and right right long after I go. The way things are heading and the way humanist want it is for good to be called bad and bad good. We see this in everything from perversion (homosexuality to killing the unborn).

Roy,

I could not agree more. The gap between what Christ said and did, and the preachings of most Churches and Christians is the cognitive dissonance that scares most of us away. The idea of a right-wing Christian is beyond an oxymoron (which country would Christ bomb?), and the Crusades, Inquisitions, Indulgences, Conquistadors and Pogroms have nothing to do with creating the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth. If a camel passes through the eye of a needle before a rich person sees God, and Christ kicks over the tables of the moneylenders in the Temple, where the hell did Protestant Prosperity Theory come from? The Romans knew this, and the Egyptians before them, Religion is Power. And we humans are not equipped to handle absolute power, it inflames our base nature.

Didn't Christ say 'Don't judge, lest ye be judged'? I am sure that Christ would have accepted a gay person into his flock, he took in lepers, prostitutes and Samaritans after all. And I am sure that Christ would have sided with the emotionally and socially crippled person who self-medicates with drugs. Capital 'C' Christians should wake up to themselves and stop trying to force the world to change to calm their own demons. As Roy said, the only power we truly have is our example. If the Christian life was better, was producing happier, more balanced people, there would be no decline active religiosity. Instead people see hypocrisy, power games and money making.

Wherever Religion enters the Australian body politic, I will be there. Not on my watch.

Sounds like a definite 'egg before the chicken' to me. 'Act as if' it is important and eventually people will believe it is important. Coercion and social engineering underpin event gestures such as this and should be nipped in the bud and decried very loudly by all those who believe reason (and don't forget, reasons can change depending on context and circumstances) and not 'faith' should be the dominating factor in political discussion.

Just like everywhere in the West, people are being 'softly, softly, catchey monkey', coralled back to the dark ages. Personally, I wouldn't vote for anyone who trumpets their religious convictions louder than their reasoned arguments concerning social policies.

At the end of the day, around 8% of Australians bother to go to
churches, so the Christian lobby is little more then a small but
very noisy minority group.

We saw in America what happened, with a so called "born again
Christian" as US prez. I would not wish another George Bush
on my worst enemy!

Here most politicians seem smarter then that. They realise that
every vote counts, so placating the little old lady down the
street who is god fearing and goes to church, can make a difference.
But best to just soothe and placate, not actually do a hell of
a lot, or the other 92% of voters will get upset. Once the silent
majority gets upset, there is no chance of winning an election.

We have a few religious extremists with an agenda in parliament,
luckily not many. Best that they are exposed and hopefully
booted out at the next elections. We want freedom of religion,
but also freedom from religion. Today Australia is very much
a secular country and politicians would be wise to remember that.

And amen to all of that, Yabby ;)

Couldn'a put it better meself.

Roy,

"Didn't Christ say 'Don't judge, lest ye be judged'? I am sure that Christ would have accepted a gay person into his flock, he took in lepers, prostitutes and Samaritans after all."

couldn't agree more - the only people Jesus seems to have a problem with in the Gospels are "money lenders" (bankers), "scribes" (lawyers), "pharasees" (clerics) and those who advocate violence as a means of persuasion (refused the sword).

It always amazes me when I see/hear Christians like, runner:

"The way things are heading and the way humanist want it is for good to be called bad and bad good. We see this in everything from perversion (homosexuality to killing the unborn)."

who jump on the homosexuality and abortion bandwagon - and have never a word to say about the war-mongers amongst their own sect. People who genuinely follow Christ have only one thing in mind - bringing disparate groups of people together, in PEACE. You don't need to be a "Christian" to do that either.