To Martin, Coach, Philo and others that are not aware that there other people on earth, other than you.

We are queer, we are here and we have no fear.

We are your next door neighbours, we are the two blokes or two women, we are just us.

We are happy, how can you not be happy also, its dead easy. Communicate and interact, thats what make a happy cohesive community.

We love you all

Baz and bazza xx

News from Israel;
"Organizers of the Gay Pride events in Jerusalem have pre-empted what was likely to be a police cancellation of their parade, calling it off. The week-long WorldPride event, however, including the conferences, film festival, exhibitions, and "Youth Day" outside the Knesset, are still scheduled to take place during the week of August 6-12 in Jerusalem.

Rabbi Yehuda Levin, of the Jews for Morality organization has come to Israel for weeks at a time on several different trips specifically to fight the Gay Pride events, Rabbi Levin calls upon Jerusalem Mayor Uri Lupoliansky not to allow the organizers to use city facilities such as Binyanei HaUmah (the Jerusalem Convention Center) or the Cinematek for what he calls their "moral terrorism."

Levin told Arutz-7 he has been working with a group of doctors who sent the Health Ministry statistical proof that previous gatherings of homosexuals around the world have led to an increase in AIDS in those locations.

The police had been under great pressure from political, religious and grassroots leaders to refuse to approve the march. Many assume that this is the explanation for the announcement issued yesterday (Sunday) by the Jerusalem Open House:
"As a result of the current hostilities in the region, the Jerusalem
WorldPride march will be postponed. [It] requires extensive security,
including police reinforcements from other parts of the country, which the police are unable to provide for at these volatile times. Therefore, Jerusalem Open House will hold the march at a later date, as soon as the circumstances in the region allow for the march to take place."

Medical Statistics:
Dr. Daisy Stern of Kiryat Arba, the initiator of the medical statistical study presented to the Health Ministry, quotes European researcher Francois Hamers. Hamers is an advocate of surveillance of sexually transmitted infections at a continental level, because of their sharp increase in many European countries.

The 22% increase of HIV diagnoses in 2002, for instance, was "largely driven by the UK," Hamers writes, but "increasing trends were also noted recently in most other countries.Belgium, Denmark, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland and especially Ireland, where the rise has been even more striking than in the UK." Except for Belgium, these countries were the sites of large international gay pride events.

Similarly, Stern writes, a study in Rome found that new HIV infections increased between 2000-2003 - right after "half a million gays and lesbians reveled there in a week-long homo-lesbian extravaganza."

Furthermore: In German, new HIV diagnoses among men who engaged in homosexual activity almost doubled from 2001 TO 2004 - more than twice the increase of previous years.

"If one correlates the figures of new incidence of HIV in the various years and localities where EuroPride, WorldPride, and such eevents occurred," Dr. Stern writes in her six-page study, "there is no doubt that the correlation with new cases of positive HIV... is striking. Add to that the dramatic rise in associated sexually transmitted diseases, the increase in high risk behavior, the use of recreational drugs, the mobility from country to country, and the fact that Israel, of all 'European' countries, has the largest relative rise in new HIV cases, and the recipe for an absolute disaster [is clear]."

Considering homosexuality only affects those indulging, are they worried they may catch it within their church from the number of deviants filing the pews. Wouldn't they be glad their god has sent aids to wipe out all people they believe evil, or will it finally empty the pews.

Martin, in your arrogance you assume those disagreeing with you are ignorant of the book. Yet they display more understanding of the fallacy than you ever do. Your revolving drivel, like Philo,Coach the bizarre BD and the other clones shows ignorance on all subjects, particularly history and intellectual understanding. If you weren't so dangerous to the sanity of the world, we could all just enjoy the laugh.

Aids is a lifestyle disease, its transferred by body fluids. Sex can play a part in its transmission, note its out of control in countries taken over by monotheists. Sensible people may ask, did god bring this upon the people. It would fit in with his other sick jokes, like follow me and I will give you heaven, after we've had a few more wars and decimated everything. This Barren bomb crated desert I give you to fight over, its my land and will be your heaven. Typical godly expression.

The biggest problem faced by the world is the constant violent interference in peoples lives by monotheists and the massive problems they cause life.

Any sensible homosexual, would realise the despotic world the followers of god create and steer well clear, but then again, fools are fools, no matter what their belief.

Martin of course many atheists are like your mythical jesus, they leave people alone and get on with life and learning just as he did. Its the followers of the books who are the lost sheep, not the theory.

Philo, I googled aids statistics and your sources, I think it may be wise for you to provide links to verify some of your statements, is this selective evidence again, or does it come direct from god.

Martin - you missed a significant part of the equation.

But all things being equal e.g. heredity, environment, and loving exercise of free will it logically follows if Jesus was not who christains say he was a believer will do much more harm than a non-believer, simply because they use their distorted map of reality to justify actions that cannot be justified.

Our maps are probably distorted but those who care try and allow for that fact, we don't have the commands of a god to hide behind to allow us to ignore other considerations. We try and cut some slack for those who make different choices to the ones we make.

R0bert

Reality check,
“Here is the problem. What are the higher order priorities that society should value and that should, by virtue of their nature, be immutable and promoted?”

1+1=2 is an immutable concept. Outside the physical laws and sciences, nothing is immutable. We can like it or not, everything is open to change. You can’t hold back changes. People have free will and many options in life.
The church can hold on to their standard and discuss their point of view about higher order priorities. Or people can indeed be apathic and stupid, or have different views and clashing opinions, or believe the opposite of what the church believes.
I am not denying that the church opinion doesn’t or shouldn’t count- but it is not (and should not be) the only voice. It’s good to discuss things from all angles.
People can all argue their case, express their view about right of life, divorce and marriage etc- that’s probably all we can do; after that things either stay the same or change. We all have to accept that.

“If we apply the principles of tolerance & free speech as 'a priori' absolutes to matters, then we end up with the mess we have.”

Things were always a mess. And I am very happy and grateful about some changes that were made despite the church’s opinion.
For example, before abortion was legalised women died because of dangerous backyard abortion operations.
The church was against contraception too- who in their right mind these days wants supersised families? Even if they did want them, who could afford them? Imagine if this hadn’t changed- I’d have about ten kids instead of just the two I opted for. I’d be slaving away in a kitchen, scrubbing and cleaning all day every day. I’m grateful for contraception!
Many people and little kids have died because of religious wars.
It might be a mess now, but it has always been a mess.