My post answering taos question got deleated.
The thread is about unions and the death of one miner the rescue of two more.
It should also be about workchoices ,the most unfair law ever passed in Australia in my lifetime.
Non conservative voteing Australians are not helped by radical thinking that overlooks the need for daily action to highlight the dreadfull workchoices act.
And the truth is the ALP alone in goverment can undo this dreadfull crime against all who work in Australia.

Dunart, Tao knows what he's talking about, unlike yourself.

Unions bring some sort of balance to all workers whether they belong
to a union or not. You tell me who is going to keep big business honest if not for the unions? Answer is no one.

Unions are far from perfect and have made many mistakes, however
they are needed more now than ever before. Thats the fact.

Belly: I suggest you re-post your answer. I’m beginning to think you are being evasive.

Sly: tao is a she. And no, unions are not the answer. Refer to my earlier posts. I will try to elaborate later.

Shorbe: Marxists (the real ones) warned years ago that the Stalinist Soviet Union would return to capitalist property relations due to objective economic conditions. Stalinism is not Marxism, or socialism. I will try to elaborate later but you might want to read this article http://www.marxists.org/archive/cannon/works/1953/socialistamer.htm (What a Socialist America Will Look Like) it was written in the 1950s and is therefore dated, is bit of a departure from theoretical Marxism and a bit utopian but you will probably find that there are many similarities with your own ideal – I actually cried when I read it. A caveat is that the struggle for socialism is not a bed of roses and no-one knows how society will be organized because it will be up to the people to decide for themselves. I’m sure you’ll pooh-pooh me and not even read it, but I really think you should know what you are rejecting outright.

You are right that the people of Eastern Europe have rejected Stalinism for the “freedom” and “democracy”. of capitalism. I don’t think it is true however that all of the people are pursuing capitalism with fervour. Again, the people who have most benefited from the break-up of the Soviet Union are an elite group. There are now 33 (reported) billionaires in Russia according to Forbes rich list while conditions for the majority are worsening - http://www.wsws.org/articles/2006/apr2006/russ-a03.shtml. I don’t think they got what they were hoping for.

to be continued

continued from above

And just take a look at what is happening in Latin America – a rejection of capitalism by the people. However, their problem is that while the people they are voting for are socialist sounding, their economic systems (and their leaders) are not really socialist.

Your own description of wanting to get out of the rat-race is also an expression of your rejection of the system we live in. Don’t you think we all think that way? Consider the increasing number of “sea-changers”. The problem is, most of us don’t have the choice, and we really can’t just escape from it any way.

You seem to think we all “choose” the system we are living in, when in reality we are born into it, have to make our way in it, are indoctrinated into its ideology, and are not offered any alternative – of course we think it’s the best. Abused children still love their parents and believe that their family is the way life is. Just because we exist in it, doesn’t mean we have chosen it.

I'm hoping and working for something better,

Got to go for a while,

tao

Tao, I did not say unions were the answer. I sad they are needed for balance especially for big business. Big difference darling.

Tao here is my answer to why you and I are never going to agree, and why I remain proud to disagree.
My life as a unionist who beleives in workers rights has seen blokes climb a crane and fling pockets full of stones at police below, then cry out police had thrown the stones!
While below a fellow made the very first fire bomb I had ever seen and pelted it at the police van!
Never would I do that! and my members would not remain my members if I did, of that I am proud.
I with every fibre of my being beleave only via a Labor goverment can workers get fairness back into the workplace.
And every thing I have ever learnt tells me some very foolish people on the extreme left are prepared to harass the ALP rather than face the fact the views they hold are not suported by any number other than a minority.
My income is less than you think, and like every job I ever had fully earnt!
The secret to life is loveing what you do for a liveing and then working hard.
The ALP runs no shadow conservative plan, we are the only altenative goverment.