The Christian majority in OZ has tried to deliver a soft gospel (feel good ) no Hell,no repentance ,lots of music and entertainment,lovely soft preaching at the pulpit ,never offending, so we a have a society out of control and we do need control ,church is very little difference to the worldly unbeliever's I am one of them ,a Christian a follower of Christ.

What we need, is Hell fire preacher's and some voluntary pray - ers to wake Aussie's up before too late ,as Indonesia waits in the wings to take Australia if they can ,assisted by any Muslims nations willing to help.
At the moment they are too busy killing each other in ME.

The critic of churches and Christians above, is right, in many ways we are not a light in the community ,except the good ol salvo's although we sent many people to Archai and other non Christian lands to help and always do ,just as the USA always do too,so I ask were you one of them helping others ?

The USA had to invade Iraq otherwise they would invade ( the Muslism) look at Iran, would takeover USA ,Australia,NZ and UK, which they are having a good try at doing .

The UK is the most Islamised Western country in the world,to their sorrow, for allowing multiculturalism in .

I never see Muslims flying in supplies of water, food,tents and medical aid to non - muslims nations where by we Christians put humans first (God's Love) we are not racist or colour concious .

Muslims are racist ,and religion fills their otherwise dull days .

To get an idea of real Islam go to (www.Alberto Rivera.com )and read on line ,"The Prophet", in comic form, a history of Islam from the beginning . Then you can criticise Christianity .
What other religion would you prefer?

All others have failed including religion of humanism,atheism and hedonism all cause chaos.

Bashir Goth, Just read your article and skimmed through the responses. Usual there. Especially I notice the "political correctness" of the usual enthusiasts.

One thing I like about BG's article is it is an example of not letting political correctness restrict your writing or comments. Too many people, especially extremists, think it is a just an excuse to ignore the accepted academic and behavioural boundaries and present unrefereed works (works that a high-schooler can pick as positioned propaganda) as academic writing and slag off at people that they are clearly prejudiced against.

I just wish we had some Christians who were brave enough to take a long hard look Christian religion and its failings. Likewise, I wish people would see that Christianity is not all evil because of the behaviour, exploitation and shrewdness of people who stripped of their power and privilege are just - well their just stonehearts working the system.

Instead we get the the usual crew jumping on the band wagon to attack other religions. Too afraid to rile against their own religion because of their own political correctness.

The hypocrisy of those who use politcal incorrectness of the malicious kind to attack was seen recently with the flag-burning carry on. I think it funny that those who hijacked the move to not let political correctness hinder open discussion and turned into a reason to indulge in their prejudices are the first to whinge and whine when someone like the flag burners gives them a dose of their own political incorrectness. What they really wanted was to criminalise politcally incorrect behaviour that they helped provoke and promote. Of course, there was not too much concern showed when an equally offensive (politically incorrect ) suggestion that an Indigenous Australian should leave Australia if he didn't like it

Christianity is also insulted everday by Christians themselves. Just look at the way Christians think and act- not in that "this is wrong and that is that way" but in that "this is justified because the end is good way". So our Christian politicians lie and break the ten commandments because they adopt utilitatirian way whilst parading as Christians and with every deceit, every death, the authority of Christian rules is undermined and the ultimate end that a true christian asires to slips further away.

Paul tells us "Be not overcome of evil, But overcome evil with good." (Disables)

Response to 'its not easy being':

Your additional words to the Dead Kennedy song are disgusting and show a contempt for others. You have provided a very violent and offence reference. I don't find the vulgarity of your words are disguised at all.

Nobody should be treated in this fashion, even if they are a public figure. You may strongly disagree but not like this, especially when apologies were given and the record was set straight.

This is twice now, that posters have resorted to violent imagary against people. It is unacceptable.

Where are the forum administators. Because I will not participating in a forum where the rules are not respected or enforced.

Response to David Boaz:

No, we are all expected to be tolerant. There is no 'host'.

If you don't like the UN, that's your opinion, but you are exagerating my claims about it. What I said was "Australia is an active member of the UN" as evidence that Australians do care what happens in other countries. If anyone is following this tread, which I doubt, then for your original statement of "We also actually have little problem with such belief systems in 'their' countries." requires something to justify the "we", otherwise, it's at best "a few."

If you don't like the UN as as example of our promotion in justice in other countries, then take the Commonwealth of Nations, the International Parliamentary Union or the International Criminal Court as examples of our interest. Or for that matter our peacekeeping efforts in Cambodia, East Timor or Solomon Islands, to name a few.

It still seems to me that your views are at odds with all Australia does.

Oh Al: [If I may call you that?] So you read a great many ancient tomes. So you see them as written by honest,decent, truthful scribes, - they were human weren't they? So you see their writings as genuine and you see that the Bible writers copied them - how flamin original and how flamin scholarly? If there were any copying then they would have plagarised the Bible stories. You see I look at the Bible as from God Himself using various human authors. This Supreme Immortal Creator does not need to nor does He plagarise any writings by mortal, farting, dribbling,piddling, totally biassed and absolute lying humans. We of course are no better than them although we kid ourselves that we are. Back to your old books I think maybe you will find another story that the Bible has plagarised in your most scholarly and honest research. I bet you have a copy of "The Da-Vinci Code" and you probably think it honest, true and a good read? numbat

An earlier post by DL had a link to a rebuttal. In it, the writer quotes Goth..

"He (Goth) states: '… the Danish people have the right to behave the way they want to behave on their own turf.' "

then their rebuttal...

"If we apply the logic of his (Goth's) statement to Moslems behaving as they wish in their own countries would it not justify the kind of behaviour he is condemning in Moslems?"

In fact, the writer's own 'logic' provides an example of philosophical difficulty. To the west, Muslims don't have countries, citizens do. Islam's not a 'state' it's a religion like Judaism (which similarly and erroneously claims a 'state' for itself). 'Religion' is considered neither a salient nor appropriate plank of a nation state although it may well illuminate the social and historical character of a particular country.

To repeat the bloody obvious, the US (and Australia et al.) didn't invade "Islamland" or "Muslimia" or even seek to attack muslims specifically, it invaded a country called "Iraq".

I'm getting tired of non-Iraqis who've claimed the country/war for themselves as if they own these. Solidarity is one thing, bullsh*t is another.

Having lived there, albeit decades ago in Mek, it sh*ts me everyday of this inexplicable war to have to listen to propaganda of non-Iraqis who claim to know all about everything simply because of their religion. Until 'muslim' becomes a nationality I am not listening, it's generally divisive to discussions of Iraq and possible future models of statehood.

By 2006, it's become more than a mere irritation to listen to this Orwellian obfuscation from people who have probably never even been there. I wish I could ask Iraqis to speak up and tell the foreigners (myself included) what THEY think. It's their country, it belongs to them and they need unity not this claptrap they are served up by militant foreigners with ulterior motives.

Obviously we hope the war will end soon and be followed by real living peace, reconstruction and much better lives for everybody. Not because the Iraqis are muslims but because they are people.