Te

I have politely and reasonably answered your question.

The fact that I am alive and well today is a result of being well informed all those years ago and of course practising safe sex (condoms).

Today of course I still would use condoms.

Now if you are at all genuine you would have had the courtesy to answer MY question, which in case you have forgotten, is:

What, in your humble opinion, would be the best outcome for unwanted, unneeded embryos created as a result of IVF?

Until you have the grace to answer my question, which was posed prior to your questions, I will remain convinced that you do not care about the welfare of either women or children, least of all any posters to OLO who have the temerity to disagree with you. Your raison d'etre appears to be the same as other anti-choice advocates: an implanted foetus has rights above and beyond all other independent life.

Yabby - do you think we will ever get straight answers to our questions?

I don't.

They will just continue to puff a smokescreen over the issues - of course not answering is of itself an answer. If it isn't in religious text they are clueless.

Yabby You actually miss the whole point of being involved in a faith. It is not for what it does for you, it is all about loving God and doing our best not to offend His. I lead a far from boring life - as most of my friends will tell you, I do more in an hour than many people do all week. No, I am not 'frantically' busy but do my best to ensure this world is a better place for me having been in it, not worse.

Yabby If there is nothing after this life as you claim, than noone will ever know you are right, as there will be nothing. However, if I am right, I will be proved right forever and ever and ever. :-))

Again I say, my heart goes out to you in the emptiness of your life. Sex, drugs, rock'n'roll, bigger houses, better cars, more gorgeous women/men, more money never creates more happiness (in the long run), just a better class of misery. To see this point proven, just look at all the rich high profile people - suicide by the score. Contrast that with Mother Teresa living a life of poverty picking up rat-eaten dying beggars off the street. Not an ounce of despair in her life, constantly smiling and happy and doing all she could to improve this world.

A question - whom do you help? When was the last time you went out of your way to help someone? do people feel they can call on you for assistance? Do you visit your aging parents?? etc etc

I am so blessed to have the brothers/sisters that I have as they are giving and caring. I wonder can your family say the same about you?

Te, your flawed perceptions of the world seem due to your inability to see it through others eyes, not just your limited view. Flawed perceptions lead to flawed assumptions, which is what you are making.

You cannot imagine that people lead fulfilling lives without religion, yet they do!
Do you think that Ian Frazer, Fiona Woods, Fred Hollows, David Attenborough,
David Suzuki, Socrates and a host of others, really lead or led empty lives?
Do you think that those people just want fast cars and more money? You are kidding
yourself if you do. Because you think that life is empty without religion does not make it so. You have clearly never thought about what those many people, all who do
good for the world and want to leave it a better place, have thought about and why.
Perhaps you should try reading some philosophy 101.

I don’t see Mother Theresa as you do. She was an obsessive religious fanatic who was happiest living her obsession. Obsessives are happiest doing exactly that.
Forget the Catholic spin and read what the critics wrote about her. Huge amounts of
money were raised, much of it was never accounted for, nobody knows how much went to the poor and how much went to promote her religion. Many people who actually worked for her, saw her in a very different light.

You also misunderstand the emotion of love. Love is an emotion based on how somebody or something makes YOU feel, so clearly loving your god makes you feel good, that’s why you believe so strongly. Anxiety about uncertainty limits your thinking beyond that. The violin string explains that.

There are plenty of miserable Catholics in the world. Plenty of greedy ones too.
Many of the Mafia were churchgoing Catholics remember. There are also plenty
of people who lead fulfilling lives without needing religion as a crutch to cope,
Because you can’t imagine such lives, doesn’t mean that they don’t happen, as the
evidence shows.

Meg, I’ll leave your distorted and vitriolic rant for when I am allocated another post

Yabby I believe. You choose not to. Mother Teresa was a saint. You say no. Malcolm Muggeridge became a Catholic because of her.

I believe in the value of EVERY life. You believe only in the value of your own.

I see no point wasting more of my posts on you and your endless 'merry-go-round' logic.

Meg1 and mjpb - good on you for your posts.

If God was woman, at least a third of us would not be here… hey, I just stumbled across my own personal epiphany!

Te, if I only believed in the value of my own life, I would not be here, arguing
for the lives of women in the third world, demanding answers to the question as to why we should accept that the effects of Catholic dogma
are killing them by the tens of thousands. I would be
out playing golf or something.

I have continued with these posts for one good reason. I believe in the butterfly effect and if some lurkers read some of the links that I have posted,
think about some of the points I have made and pass on that information,
we might yet expose to the general public the tragedy that Catholic dogma is inflicting on the third world. Luckily by far the majority of 1st world Catholics have basically told the church to get lost on these issues.

Its quite disgusting but not surprising, that none of you has expressed outrage
that your church thinks that 9 year old girls who are raped, should be forced to have the child. Clearly its not people you care about, but blindly followed
dogma, right over the cliff of decency and any kind of morality.

Te, I did not expect any different reaction from you then the one I got. Clearly
the questions I have posed, you have never even thought about and don’t have answers to. Its easier to just be a violin string, following your feelings.

If you girls really cared about potential people as much as you say do and not
just dogma, then clearly you would care about the many potential children that you have flushed down your toilets, not just pretend to become teary eyed about fertilized eggs. Blind faith in dogma is what its all about, as the
evidence shows.

Meg, your attempt to try to use the tragedy of the Tasmanian miners to
try to score a few cheap points on OLO in a discussion, shows the standards of your ethics. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Dianne, you are are a great lady and I appreciate your honesty.
Many thanks!