The New testament is the source of the 'divine right of Kings' (dictators) to rule 1 Pet. 2:13,14 Rom.13:1-2 Luke 19:12-27

Christianity approves of slavery and says that slaves must do the bidding of their master even if he is cruel and beats them. 1Pet. 2:18-29 Ephesians 6:5-6 1 Timothy 6:1-2 Matt. 10:24 Matt. 24:45-46 1Tim. 6:1-5 Titus 2:9-10.

Jesus became a SLAVE to free SLAVES - and if anyone is in SLAVERY, he/she can look to JESUS as a ROLE MODEL.

Christians shouldn't mix with unbelievers 2 Corinthians 6:14-17

Jesus is a Friend of SINNERS, yet he didn't get SIN through them.

Paul lays a curse on someone Timothy: 1:19-20

Well, Jesus says :BLESS THOSE WHO CURSE YOU.

That jews will be cast into hell Matt: 8:11-12

JESUS SAID : " If anyone believes in ME, he/she has ETERNAL LIFE (HEAVEN)

That you must pay all taxes Luke 20:21-26

JESUS PAID TO THE ROMANS - GIVE UNTO GOD WHAT IS GOD's, GIVE UNTO CEASAR WHAT IS CEASAR's..

The New testament is the source of the 'divine right of Kings' (dictators) to rule 1 Pet. 2:13,14 Rom.13:1-2 Luke 19:12-27

Kings & Priests in the Kingdom of LOVE, - what a privilege!

no problem believing that the Holy Spirit impregnated Mary, who then gave birth to a man-god who got killed, came back to life and then ascended into the sky.

Yes, It is Joy to believe in the TRUTH.

when hearing about how God/Jehovah slaughtered all the babies of Egypt in "Exodus" and ordered the elimination of entire ethnic groups in "Joshua" including women, children, and trees etc, etc.

JESUS says TO LOVE ENEMIES; HE hasn't killed anyone - HE did GOOD THINGS - for which HE was KILLED. and I follow JESUS.

deny the existence of thousands of gods claimed by other religions, but feel outraged when someone denies the existence of yours.

There are many "gods" and "goddesses" but they haven't done anything for me. I believe in JESUS who DIED for ME

Aziliz

You certainly have the intellect yet your logic is far from logical.
Do you really believe that you can make a smorgasboard of gods and just pick what you like and discard what you dont.
If there is indeed a God (and you know my veiw) what on earth makes you think he/she/it will make itself up under the flawed logic of man? dont you think thats even just a little naive not to mention vain.

The difficulties you see in the bible get quite clear when you have the tenacity to learn what it is you are reading in the context of the book.

Theres a saying 'A text without a context becomes a proof text for a pretext'
in other words, to use a computer analogy, if you torture the data enough it will confess to anything.

You need to take into account " the entire council of God " and to do that you need to be led by the spirit.

But that to you is just Christianese babble, and gives you more empty arguments to throw around.

Christ said " if i tell you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if i tell you heavenly things." John 3: 12

The biggest problem with Christianity is that it is so simple its so difficult.
"a Stumbling block to many" "wisdom of God is foolishness to man" " Professing to be wise they became fools" you need to read Romans 1.

I am finding this forum incredibly enlightning, everything i read here confirms biblical prediction about the state of man.

I'm sorry mate i guess i'm just as frustrrated with this topic as you are.

In the end we are either correct or incorrect. if we are incorrect we have wasted our lives following this path, and our eternity will be either non existant or with everyone else.
If correct however the implication is eternal, sorry i'm truly not that big a gambler.

You really want to make sure you know what you know. we aint betting with matches here.

Aziliz, with me it was

Christianity is all just love, mercy and forgiveness. Jesus loved everyone forgave even his executioners, healed and generally was this great guy - so what!

Thought the God thing was a fairytale. Until life forced me to ask the question seriously 'who is Jesus' . I said to God ok I need you now and the help came the next day. I asked from my heart and there it was, and Our Lord hasn't left since, I know him better each day.

As for other religions Aziliz what about St Matthew's Gospel the sheep and the goats? What about the Good Samaratan (the Samaratans were fierce enemies of the Jews).

If you emphasise hell and judgment you have to emphasise the love and forgiveness too!

Anyway don't you want justice. If a Nazi tortured and murdered your entire family right now wouldn't a good God demand justice?

If God is real his justice must be real too. If he's made his choice to reject God despite knowing enough of the good, how can God give him what he does not want?

The gates of Hell are locked from the inside Aziliz. Look at the demons in the bible, they know God exists but choose themselves and hell rather than love and other people.

an example is Johcol a few posts ago.

Given the millions of needs in our families, communities etc our time could be spent using our gifts for the benefit of others. Its this that brings true joy and happiness.

If johcol persists in his self centredness for long enough eventually he'll be lost and wont be able to find his way back. He could be making his parents proud, he could be bringing his friends along in his achievements. Instead of risking an abortion his sanctity could reveal things that would otherwise remain hidden. That thing he identifies as himself is nothing more than an ego protected by illusions. His real self can only be given by God and only in the way Jesus showed.

And who can say how many steps it takes away from the true path before return is impossible, ie how long a person persists in sin before they become deaf to God's voice permanently. Sin also insults the majesty of God. Satan squirms will delight when humans do the wrong thing.

Jesus chose to be a human from the beginning and all humans are modelled on him. Given that he is God too, all we have to do (as humans as well) to gain this zoe life this divine life is to accept Jesus. Its a free gift. Or we settle down into a sub humanity and mere bios life. Accepting the gift we become who we are supposed to be - like God in Heaven in eternity with Him. Or the other place if we don't like that flavour. But we have to reckon with lies along the way.

Satan is trying to get Johcol lost and confused (and is clearly doing a good job), and God (who brought him to this forum) is trying to win his beloved child back.

R0bert,

I watched from a distance your heartfelt debate. Most was being said without my input.

Let’s sum up.

1. You chose not to believe anymore in God and his paraphernalia by exercising your right of freedom of choice
2. You based your decision on what you have observed of the church and your perception of God’s inability to manage his “affairs” on earth.
3. You claim that Christians don’t identify with the possibility to change ones mind after being ‘born again’
4. You question (our) ability to think outside God’s box and evaluate other options out there
5. The sum total of your Christian experience have left you at best wanting and unsatisfied; you even wondered if there was more that was needed (tongues, signs,…)
6. You fail to differentiate between the visible manifestation of God’s church and God himself (as we discussed) therefore you rejected both
7. You believe that Christians are narrow minded and/or brainwashed and therefore any other views are shunted aside and cannot possibly be entertained
8. You take much relief and comfort in your decision ‘not to believe’ by convincing yourself (and others) that it was the right decision
9. Now looking from the outside in, you can even substantiate your convictions
10. You distrust other opinions as biased and shallow

I don’t buy into that. I think (gut feel) that you are seeking validation by exposing your puzzling unspiritual realm on this forum.

The only plausible explanation to me (still is) that you have never been “born again” (die to self and rise with Christ as a new creation). It does happen. Many go through the motions but never have a true longterm hand in hand relationship with Him.

The facts of the reality and existence of God are there; and not like you say a fairy tale. But it is up to you and your strength of character to face up to it instead of taking the cowardly and easy way out.

Sorry but that is how it looks to me even if you don’t agree.