Meredith,

First, to say that apostasy is the reason why Muslims don't change thei religion is absolute non-sense, many Muslims go to other religions or no-religion into their own communities were I lived and grew up for example. There was an Egyptian communist political movement since the 60s. I lived in a north african Muslim country.

Second, the apostasy statement has no proof or support in the Quran.
There in no compulsion in religion in many parts of the Quran and belief is a choice, the apostasy have a supporting hadith that came 300 years after Mohamed (PBUH) died.

Islam is probably the simplest form of religion for the mind to digest, that is why (in my personal view) it is the fastest growing.

See www.musliminsight.blogspot.com under ‘theology made simple.

Peace,

“FH: Not in Australia, but Bosnia 1996, Orthodox Christians (Lead by an Orthodox Priest) killed 8,000 Muslim women and children, cut off two fingers of each hand (babies were not spared) so they meet Jesus with “Trinity” fingers. I have not seen any condemnation and the Pope said : “we are all Christians”, should I assume he included those criminals as well?”
Posted by Fellow_Human, Tuesday, 22 November 2005 4:16:49 PM

Fellow human,

Which particular atrocity are you referring to. I have never heard of 8000 people having their fingers removed so as to mock their religious sensibilities. Please provide details as I am truly shocked and wish to read about it. The name of the priest or the atrocity would be useful.

As for the condemnation that was so obviously lacking, I would have thought the US/NATO bombing raids and troops would seem fairly unequivocal, don't you. Of course islamic nations are hardly known for stepping in to save Christians or other religionists, especially if the perpetrators are fellow muslims.

I am sure that the papal quote is out of context. It is a bit hard to believe that John Paul would have said that in reference to such a heinous war crime. Perhaps you would like to elaborate so that it can be checked for accuracy.

Sage,
Well if your familiarity with the qur'an is the same as your anorectic view of christianity I have one word for you: fool.

And the insults are flying thick and fast.

A beautiful, poignant piece by Bashir is threatened with the usual devolution into religious squabbling.

The point of Bashir's article is similar to that of Shakira's - that Muslims are under threat by extremists.

And what is happening? Just more of the same religion bashing by Christian fundies.

Where is the comradeship? Where is the support by people who believe in one god?

Glad to be on the outside where I can appreciate the good in people without having to colour it with a religious (be it Islamic or christian) paintbrush.

As I stated in another post on another thread...

(http://forum.onlineopinion.com.au/thread.asp?article=3856#21103)

Clearly humans have a lot more emotional intelligence to develop before we can consider ourselves civilised.

Agreed Scout - a particularly beautiful, poignant piece by Bashir.

Ought Australia not actively and urgently support Australian Muslims and their Islamist theocracy¿

Countries of the greater Islamic caucus are in a process of a swift launch, elevation, bootstrap and catch-up into and up to the 21st Century.

The pace of this catch-up is and has been short and sharp; and the International Muslim community understandably suffers the vertigo of that atmospheric launch into the new day and age.

Their values are threatened; their chattel freed; their woman's thoughts, minds and sexuality emancipated; their sons tempted and wooed.

Understandably theirs are feelings of threat and rejection. Thus a section of that greater society reacts as a cornered wild animal; with rabid, demented foam at the mouth, spitting blood, claws ready to slash, scar and mutilate.

({{sighs}} - geez - gotta be a munched metaphor there somewhere¿)

Yet every successive bomb in the name of Islam signifies a measure of the chasm and gap that still oozes and hemorrhages and signifies too a measure of how truly cornered, fragile and weak that beast yet remains.

Such an animal is frantic and dangerous...

Muslims in our community (and throughout the western world) are likely the only ones able to reach out and bridge with that greater and larger frightened Islamic community. Australian Muslims are of recent immigration and as such have considered their host well - they have and do identify in Australia and do hold values 'we' hold dear–

...as such 'we' are one!

Without recourse to ASIO's thugs - if we protect that small frightened core of new Muslim Australians - overdose them with the values we hold dear; what great envoys and emissaries they in turn will become? It is their trumpet that will resonate from Marrakech to Djakarta; from the minarets of Cairo, Baghdad and Damascus.

A clarion call of freedom of thought; a call to the care of international democratic expression; and a call to the justice of an impartial judiciary...

...and importantly to soothe and console that 'we' - mean Islam no harm

Thank you, denk, I welcome you to the forum.

The old saying "united we stand; divided we fall" - never more true than here.

Our Muslim neighbours need all the support they can get right now.

Just to experiment, I donned a scarf hijab style and wore it on the train to the city. Even though I am clearly caucasian (blond/blue-eyed) I was amazed at the hostile looks and was even pushed out of the way at the exit. I don't have the courage to wear a scarf that way again. I learnt a lot (too much) about how it feels to be ostracised merely on appearance.

The best way to beat the terrorists is to stand firm with all Muslims.