David may not understand ethics, but many other people do.

David tries to put forward that a persons fundamental right to choose how they spend their own money, and effectively vote with their dollars is a plan to genocide the Israeli people and is ludicrous.

He states that common sense will hopefully prevail, but what he doesn't realise is that is what BDS is all about. The voice of the people of all over the world, and of common sense prevailing.

- And he tries to say that anyone who questions or disagrees with anything not in full support of Israel must be a Jew hater or an anti-semite or racist.

For anyone that looks, Israel clearly has an almost endless amount of genuine issues that deserve discussion and criticism but they will always try avoid any such conversations on any matter that questions Israels historical track record or its moral character and imperial aspirations.

Hi Yuyutsu

You are much more optimistic than I that any country or region can attain "inner peace". Even relatively-internally peaceful Australia hasn't achieved it and our inner cynicism (which is a positive thing) doesn't expect it.

I think the problem with the Middle East is less about country actors and more about non-state actors. Violently competing tribes/ethnic groups/religious denominations. Even Sunni tribes will fight each other for scarce resources and the many Christian tribes in Lebanon have a history of fighting amongst themselves.

Jewish factions in Israel are also frequently are disunited - sometimes violently though less so with machine guns. The Jewish people of Israel since WWII started out with the searing psychological damage of the Holocaust which brutalised many. The Promise covers it well https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Promise_%282011_TV_serial%29 .

The Middle East is not a place where Gandhi-like non-violence is understood. Just as India descended into the independence phenomenon of mass violence - that Gandhi was unable to stop during his last years. The benefits of Parliamentary Democracy are not self-evidently understood outside of Israel - Israel benefitting much from the balance of British culture.

The are distincly Arab peaceful traits of compromise that offer hope.

Regards

Pete

Dear Pete,

I know the middle east, thus Israel is and will remain armed to its teeth.

Combined with the unity achieved once Israel returns to its undisputed borders, no one, be they a state or otherwise, will dare to attack it, just as nobody dares to attack Switzerland, not even the Nazis dared, so in practice Israel will not actually need to use its superior weapons, only to keep them.

Dear Yuyutsu

True what you say.

Israe's nuclear deterrent, conventional military deterrent and often-implicit US military support mean that no state would attack Israel.

It is non-state terrorist-fighters with low tech weapons that seem the ongoing problem. Such threats too often fall between the cracks of Western countries. Even China and Russia have similar internal terrorist problems.

Regards

Pete

I'm really not interested in championing the rights of Palestinians until they recognise the right of Israel to exist.

Oh, you say, Israel came about through invasion ? Not really, but if so, then that was par for the course in the Middle East: pre-Islam, Mesopotamia was occupied almost entirely by Kurds and Persians; North Africa was populated by Copts and Berbers. Even Syria (including Palestine) was a diverse mixture of Christian, Kurdish and many other groups. Arabs were more or less confined to Arabia, fighting amongst themselves.

Hamas fired thousands of rockets into Israel last year - with the intention of what ? Doing no damage ?

Recognise Israel, and we can get back to common sense.

Joe

Given the 15 tunnels recently dug by Hamas and Palestinians trying to get into
Israel. It is obvious that Israel needs the occupied territories as a buffer zone.

Maybe the habit the Arabs had of blowing up school buses and other bombings
When there was no wall to stop them getting into Israel is the reason the wall was built in the first place.

Also if the Palestinians do not wish to be fired at by the Israelie army then maybe they should stop attacking Israel with rockets.

Have the sense not to keep poking a sleeping lion with a stick.