Duck

G'day mate. Hope your family and friends are ok in Newcastle. We started out in Taree, then Nabiac, Salt Ash, Medowie - goes on - Dad was a Raffie, fought for our freedom.

It would be good if so-called "moderate" Muslims had the guts - ugh - I mean honesty - to verbally fight for our freedom.

My father died for you bloody ungrateful people, vis a vis: moderate Muslim people who do not speak out about Islamic terrorists.

Philo / Kalweb,

Back to the subject and topic by Irfan, Muslims know that terrorism attacks are predominantly targeting moderate Muslims to form totalitarian / theological states.

I lived in the Middle East/ Egypt for 29 years of my life. Since 1980 until 1996, the so called Islamists were blowing up other Muslims in order to push them to a totalitarian state.

Islam is currently the fastest growing religion of the Abraham faith despite the propaganda machine. The war on terrorism is an ideology war and cannot be won except by moderate Muslims with the support of the west. This cannot happen by continuously alienating the Muslim majority.

Philo,

When Prophet Mohamed (PBUH) died he asked his followers to chose/ elect the leaders amongst themselves provided that he is the fittest to run the nation. The first four governors were selected by a council. That is an early form of democracy to me and majority of Muslims.

Peace,

Hey FELLOW,

Is islam the fastest growing religion or just the fastest breeders? What I mean is, how many people are converting to islam because it is such a 'great' and "peaceful" religion?

Multiplying quickly by having 7 children to 7 wives for different nights of the week is a sure way to become a majority. Better not alienate the breeding machines, shall we.

Funkster, inserting some political correctness there with your Mugabe statement. Is'nt he trying to rid the country of whites? That should be ample reason for the 'west' to get involved

Fellow_human,
Ifran's post is about radical Islam and its outworking in Bali, you seem to give tasset support to the anti-Western propaganda from radical Islam and challenge Australia's role in fighting its stronghold in Afghanistan and Iraq against the introduction of free democratic governments. You pose as a secret agent [an enemy] one opposed to Australia's role. Either you are fighting for freedom for all or undermining Australia's involvement in this cause?

Your'e not released from the radical agenda that wishes to dominate all societies, you constantly defend Islam. You would have us believe your view of Islam is not the problem. Fine! But the problem the world faces today is not the peace and tolerance you uphold, it is the entrenched belief of some Muslims who believe Islam must rule the World.

I believe in life for all including atheists. I lobbied Governments and foreign affairs Ministers when Kurds were being blown apart. I lobbied again when Muslims in Bosnia were being ethnically annihilated. You see what a person believes is irrelevant as long as that believe in the right for others to live. Instead of defending Islam as though it is the best way and comparing it to atrocities committed by so called Christians; come up with the principle that life is more important than 'my' belief. Life is God's business as he created it, and this principle outweighs any totalitarian religious doctrine.

Democracy is that every man of good will has the right to live. That is the guiding principle that forms western liberal democracy. The principle is the value of the life of all persons is equal before God and all deserve to live - even the sinful atheist. When America had to make a choice on where to drop the Atom bomb on Japan in WII they chose cities with large Christian populations. Why? Because the USA wanted the proud Japanese to see the value of all life is equal, USA deliberately chose not to bomb Shinto warmongers.

Philio, thats interesting about the Abomb, but is that really true?

I thought that the bomb site were actually backups - the weather was bad over primary target so they had to move onto secondary target, not anything to do with Christiandom....?

davo, regarding Mudgabe. Yeah, sure he got rid of some white farmers, but at the moment, he is demolishing whole suburbs where (a, opposition supporters live) (b, poor people live). On most occasions it tends to be both, as the downtrodden poor tend to support the opposition.

I would have thought if the international order was really so concerned about 'justice', 'freedom' and 'democracy' then we would be bombing the crap out of mudgabe and supporters.......

Davo,

Mix of backgrounds in the followers of Islam speaks for itself. Arabs are now less that 15% of the total Muslims world. In the last few years, there are less than a million new converts into the US and around 80,000 in Italy. You can dig out an article in the SMH few months ago under "the Lure of Allah” about the number of Australians choosing Islam.

Most Muslims of my generation and the previous have one wife and 2-3 kids at most but don’t let the truth come in the way of a good story (the 7 x 7 one!)

Philo,

I noticed your attacks always come when you run out of logic amigo!

Maybe I should tag along with your theory and cheer to see Australians in the full front of war in every country in the world? Is this your version of ‘if you are not with us you are against us?'

My message to people like yourself is:

a. There are proud Australian Muslims like myself and equally proud of both. We see our religion as peaceful and loving religion. You seem to be struggling with that.
b. I am explaining my opinion on best ways to fight fanaticism is to promote / support moderate Islam. Seems your view on peace with Islam is to fight them until they convert.
c. The fact you need to admit to yourself is that you are a radical Christian (not like Reason for example) and can never accept Islam as a religion. Just be honest to yourself and move on.

Thats it for this thread.

Peace to you all,