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The Forum > Article Comments > Fatherlessness, chaos and the Norwegian killer > Comments

Fatherlessness, chaos and the Norwegian killer : Comments

By Warwick Marsh, published 2/8/2011

'A community that allows a large number of young men to grow up in broken families...asks for and gets chaos'.

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Another rubbish article by this 'author'.
I agree fully with RObert's assertion that this guy is really pushing his usual fundamentalist Christian barrel, and is really more upset about the fact this Norwegian killer is also a fundamentalist Christian than he cares to acknowledge.

Marsh aligns himself to the anti-feminist, pro-father's groups under false pretenses.

He is more upset over single mothers, defacto marriages and 'fatherless' children because they are against his religion - which advocates lifelong marriage between two heterosexuals.

Any other family unit is a sin and has been punished by producing children who 'kill' as a result.

What of Jared Lee Loughner then, the guy who shot six people dead in the US earlier this year, including Senator Amy Gifford?
His parents were married, and he was an only child.

What of the dreadful Timothy McVeigh (Oaklahoma City Bombing), who was raised by his FATHER after his parents divorced at the age of ten?

We can't say that divorce or fatherlessness does not affect some children negatively, but so do some married parent's problems, motherlessness, and a myriad of other 'reasons' why there are criminals in the world.

I am of the opinion that once you are an adult, then YOU are fully to blame for your actions, unless therE are predetermined mental health problems.
Posted by suzeonline, Tuesday, 2 August 2011 1:28:05 PM
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Fatherlessness, chaos and the Norwegian killer", an interesting but over-stated theory of a father's absence. It negates the huge global number of fatherless boys-become-men whose lives are admirably lived in a socially just and caring manner.

The most important section is the brief mention of evil and sin. Sin is not a word I care to use, its defining coming, as it always does, from some powerful person, almost always male, speaking of what one may or may not do...the gospel according to that particular 'Him'.

Evil, however, or whatever you want to call it, the desire to harm others, the action of harming humans or other creatures, is a facet of essential humanity and intelligence. We are not automatons, our lives are not predestined, we have the grand choice of choosing exactly how we want live and be; as did Breivik. He can be seen as a man who chose to do enormous harm to many others. He should be contained, without harm, for the rest of his life.

It astonishes me that people will not accept the continuum we live with, the capacity for vast evil and great good at each end, with most of us in the middle between the two, all of us capable of acting out the full extent of good or evil.

A problem is the desire not to talk about or accept this part of our lives. The statement of evil, sin, moral relativism from Warwick Marsh has been ignored by these comments. The attitude of the Norwegian psychiatrist is pathetic; if she can only see evil actions as the result of mental illness she has not given much thought to the human condition.

Let's stop seeing "evil" as an unacceptable notion and see it as a fact of life.
Posted by carol83, Tuesday, 2 August 2011 1:39:04 PM
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@ suzeonline
Loughner shot Senator GABRIELLE Giffords but though severely disabled in the attack she's very much alive, she appeared in the U.S Senate last night to cast her vote on the new debt ceiling bill.
Posted by Jay Of Melbourne, Tuesday, 2 August 2011 2:25:23 PM
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The link between the two issues - fatherlessness and murder - is a bit tenuous. The real motivation - the resentment of Muslims in Norway - doesn't seem to rate a mention.
The feminist tendency to relativise all cultures is a link that would make more sense; and one, given time, will have to be confronted by the West.
Posted by Aristocrat, Tuesday, 2 August 2011 3:14:50 PM
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I find it astounding that many of the comments here are attacking the author of this article, when they seem to miss the point altogether.
Many years ago when Christian Family values were the ‘norm’ in most western societies, there was very little crime of any description. There were few prisons and few courts needed to try alleged criminals.
Fathers held their rightful place within the family structure. And before the feminists on this blog go off the rails at me and screech like seething harridans, I personally did not grow up in a society where women were denigrated and treated like slaves. In fact, many of the mothers of my friends worked in many varied jobs. I grew up in the 1960s, where there were still many intact families that were kept together by wonderful mothers and held secure by strong fathers.
Young men and women did not go off the rails as much as they do today. What with all the late teens dying on the roads as they in a drunken state, slide their cars across a road, then wrap themselves and all the occupants of their cars around a tree or light pole. This rarely happened in my day, because the fathers would have dealt with that behaviour long before the kid ever got a license.
Yet here we are today in the enlightened ‘new millennium’ where fathers are largely dismissed or banished from families altogether and we have crime rates that have blown out of all proportion and never been this bad throughout the history of mankind.
And you people poo poo the author’s statements that lend toward that of Christian families and fatherhood, and Christian principles.
Only a fool would say we are better off today, now that the Christian model of a nuclear family has all but been extinguished.
Posted by Paw, Tuesday, 2 August 2011 4:18:20 PM
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I grew up in the 1960's and 1970's too Paw, when there were far fewer people in Australia, and thus less crime and jails.
Maybe you never knew of crime and family problems back then, personally, but they were most definitely there for most of us.

My father played up on my mother, and left the marriage for another woman, leaving three children at home with mum in the 1970's.
How does that situation figure in your memories of the 'good ol days'?
And guess what? We all grew up to become law-abiding citizens with good jobs, families and lifestyles.

Why, whenever people mention the dreadful things that feminists are supposed to have 'done' to society- such as single motherhood, divorce, legal abortion etc, are the men who must have been involved in these situations, ignored or blameless?

Society has moved on since the the fabulous sixties Paw, for good or bad. All the 'oldies' complained about us kids/teens in the 60's and 70's too, remember?

The Norwegian killer had a father and a stepfather - but that didn't seem to stop him did it?
Sometimes no one can explain such tragedies
Posted by suzeonline, Tuesday, 2 August 2011 4:39:40 PM
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