Becca I don’t think you understand what not-for-profit agencies (which includes mostly church orgs) are doing in Australia at all or what money they receive for what services. I’m not sure why you say “we” – are you speaking for all Christians here?

Becca:”I personnally think a church should be broke because it gives everything away to whoever has a need.”

Well they aren’t – they are multi-million dollar businesses with all the perks that go with it.

Them making money doesn’t bother me but the services are built on failing some of the most vulnerable members of our society and discrimination becomes legally acceptable when a church carries out a public service here.

“Danni is right, most Churches and Christian organisations are self funded ( I can vouch for that), the government hardly gives anything to them, if at all.”

That isn’t quite what Danni said and the government is more than generous, as is the tax department. That means WE ALL give generously in Australia through what is paid in taxes then distributed about to whoever gets the public contracts. Do we receive good service in return – I believe the answer is no from what I have experienced and witnessed.

You want a list of sacrifices and good works I have done for the community? Becca I suspect you are the type of person who wouldn’t appreciate what non-Christian’s give back or sacrifice just because it is right to do so and no one commanded it or demanded it, and WE don’t believe WE will receive any reward in heaven later for doing it. Yes Muslims give too; it is part of their belief system to give to the needy as well.

Becca:”A Fact is a Fact!Get back the the thread because you are wrong.”

Nope I’m not although you’re welcome to go ahead and try to prove it.

Becca:”The Thread is on How a man can call himself a 'Proud Australian Muslim"..a contradictory in terms.”

What is wrong with you?

I speak about Christian Churches but your understanding of what constitutes a Christian Church is most likely different to what my understanding is and as I have been studying and attending for 18 years, I think I will stick with my own understanding for now.
"Becca I suspect you are the type of person who wouldn’t appreciate what non-Christian’s give back or sacrifice just because it is right to do so and no one commanded it or demanded it, and WE don’t believe WE will receive any reward in heaven later for doing it".
mmmhmmm, I come from a long background of unbelieving people,with the belief that there is no God and all Churches are money hungry etc etc..heard it all before, And my parent were both Nurses who volunteered their time and ours to Nursing homes and in schools etc - just because I did not feel the compulsion to say that I respect all above board non-for-profit orgs you immediately jump down my throat assuming I do not understand..oh my. I am an Australian through to the core, would help you without question and give if I recognize a need, you judge Christians poorly.Your experience and mine are completely different, there is nothing wrong with me Jewely for quoting the title of this thread and calling it a contradiction, perhaps you forget what the forum is for?
700,000 nonprofit organisations in Australia, most of which are small and entirely dependent on the voluntary commitment of members
380,000 nonprofit organisations are incorporated in some form or another (meaning that they have a legal identity independent from their members)
35,000 nonprofit organisations employ staff
20,000 organisations with Deductible Gift Recipient status in Australia. http://www.accord.org.au/social/infobriefs/nonprofit.html (goodwill, foresight of men and women of philanthropic, humanitarian and religious convictions - so not all Christian.. off topic again

In Jane Austen's Pride and Prejudice, pride was perceived and portrayed as an indicator of bad manners and a sign of self-importance or superiority as reflected in the journey of Mr Darcy.

Perhaps there is some lessons modern societies can take from those times (as imperfect as they might be in other ways). There are already too many proud people who are not able to separate pride from action, policy or ideals.

It was pride and (allegedley) the Christian God speaking to President Bush that sent the US into war on the false premise of WMDs; and it is pride and Islamic jihad that sends suicide bombers into restaurants and hotels. The world does not need any more Pride or blind patriotism.

What about more tolerance, more equality (less disparity) and an enhanced sense of humanity starting at the personal level and extending into the local, national and foreign arenas. What about kindness. Give me kindness over pride anyday.

Article revisited.

The author is unhappy about an indicated level of mistrust held by a portion of the Oz public towards the followers of Islam. Why would this be?

I expect our author has been in Oz for a while, but we don't know how long. Although Oz has had some Muslim residents for a great many years, there has been a substantial increase in this population in recent years, and during that period many disturbing events have occurred overseas, and some in Oz itself. Will these events have had an impact on an Oz viewpoint? Of course. Does the author address this? No. Does the author address the possible impact of these events on how Oz Muslims view their faith? No. A little one-sided? Maybe.

From memory, Saddam used chemical warfare on the Iraqi Kurds, and with his Sunni followers maintained power over the Shiia population with secret police, fear and repression. Sunni and Shiia continue to oppose each other in various quarters, without qualm about using car bombs. Taliban and fundamentalists continue to harass and kill civilians who fail to comply with their strict regimen. Iran is repressive and supposedly wants nuclear weapons. Why? To wipe out Israel perhaps? Somebody gave us 9/11 as a date to be remembered. Somebody changed our view of Bali. Somebody did the Bangkok Hilton....

In Oz, a group (of good ol' Aussies?) wanted to attack the Holdsworthy army barracks and kill a few soldiers; an Imam tried to condone rape of Aussie girls "because they were asking for it" - in his opinion. What a wonderful message from a spiritual leader.

More recently we have Tunisia, Egypt, Morocco, Libya, Bahrain, Syria... Discontent by ordinary people. All unrelated? Maybe. A common view and following of Islam? Does not look like it.

Did our author attempt to unravel any of the questions relating to Islam and its following, why it's ok for some to be suicide bombers? Many questions - unanswered. Many causes to ask what next? Where will it end? And, ultimately, who can you trust?

>> And, ultimately, who can you trust? <<

Obviously not people who believe their religion is the only one true religion.

Rebecca6,
Leaving churches out of it I fully agree with you.