Let us take a recent example of 'your' responsibility...How about the cameo performance of that alleged Senate representative from the Serial Killer State...The Friary Congregation thought her presentation was hilarious and it certainly impressed an hysterical Pyney Poo.

weareunique,
I have met a few down to earth women, very few.
Dear all,
I'm not a misogynist any more than I'm a homophobe (though I said some hard things about gay politics recently), though I do occasionally fall into misanthropy.
It's perfectly true what you say, Poirot, about men and cars; I've made the point myself before.
But I was assessing Jennifer's article as a feminist polemic, though the word is only used once and then only in a defeatist sense. Feminism, btw, came to realise that mean were just as oppressed by patriarchy as women. From my point of view, patriarchy is not the oppressor, capitalism is. For those interested read from the subheading on page 12 here: http://tinyurl.com/4jq5jet
Jennifer's article is thus more a feminine (not feminist) pep-talk, and sexual liberation, than it is social liberation.

Poirot,
I'm cutting the men some slack because they don't have a dedicated liberationist movement, whereas feminists and gays have an ostensible political agenda; my problem with them is they're watered down at best and self-obsessed at worst, with nothing to do with genuine emancipation, which for me can only mean "freedom from capitalist social ideology". To get my meaning you need to read the link above a few times.
To the extent that capitalism is a "social" and not just pseudo-scientific realm, I suspect women, as a class, are both more addicted (because more adapted) to and blithely accepting of its "logic" than men.
I've no wish to offend, only to incite fresh radical thought. Sex and gender politics are thoroughly tamed, indeed bought.

Well benk you must have indeed lived a charmed existence. Not all people have and many still live in communities where the "she asked for it" attitude is rife. You can pretend that this is malicious but it is very real and is not the same thing as accusing all men of being rapists.

I don't trash men. I have been constant in my support of men in the area of family law but it is disappointing to see the backlash when a female poster writes something negative about SOME men. It is always taken to mean ALL men and is derided whenever gender is seen to be under attack.

Being honest about some sub-sets of attitudes within the culture is not the same as 'trashing'.

Both men and women are capable of doing bad things, each of us must take responsibility for our own behaviour. Yes it is vital to teach young girls not to put themselves at risk but musn't we also teach young boys about being responsible? That is all I am saying. It is not about blaming.

JamesH
I did say "passed out" but you cleverly avoided the fact I also said "rolling drunk". It is easier to make an argument if you don't include all the facts, but it is as dishonest as benk's implication that there are no men out there who encompass those more neanderthal "she asked for it" values. Benk and others can deny that this attitude does not exist all they like but it doesn't make it true.

Some of you need to spend some time in a women's refuge or a rape crisis centre to realise that rape does happen and false accusations of rape are not the norm.

Houllie
Most men are great, yes two people can have sex when they are intoxicated (as opposed to paraletic) and can still clearly give consent. I agree it is a difficult argument to apportion blame when neither could in real terms give 'absolute' consent (defined as being of 'sound mind'). We are not talking about the nuances but the fact that 'real' rape does exist, and we do society a disservice by nitpicking semantics and using the nuances as the standard. Clearly I am not talking about nuances and I agree responsibility does by cultural standards rest with the man. Maybe because men have always been perceived as the aggressors ie. making the first move.

My wish is that men and women would step up to the plate as regards respectful attitudes and behaviours and not see the world through one-gender lenses.

I would suggest that if we have a drunk couple fumbling together and managing to have consensual sex eventually, that if one then alleged rape it would be very hard to prove.

If, however, the drunken couple have sex and the woman is obviously beaten and injured during the act, and then accuses him of rape, I would imagine it wouldn't matter how drunk he was, he would absolutely have to be charged at least with assault.

If the injuries were of a sexual nature, then obviously rape could be considered.

There are no reasons that I can think of where a woman 'deserves' to be raped.

Most rape allegations never make it to court anyway, due to lack of evidence. I imagine that more real rapists get off because of this reason than they do because they were actually innocent.

I wonder what some of the anti-feminist brigade would suggest is a reason for rape when it is drunken men being anally raped... as happened recently by a now convicted male taxi driver?

Were these poor men dressed too provocatively as well?
Maybe their trousers were too tight?
Maybe they showed too much chest hair and muscle?
Were they making themselves too irresistible to gay rapists?

Was it because they didn't 'take responsibility' and not allow themselves to get too drunk and have to go home in a taxi?

If not, why not?

There's a difference between taking responsibility, and blame.

Nobody male or female deserves to be raped. The victim can never be blamed for a rapist's actions.

Taking responsibility means making informed choices and decisions.

If I walk on broken glass with bare feet I know my feet will get cut.

Being out of control means I'm more vulnerable to predators than I would be if I had my wits about me.

I can choose to get blind drunk in a safe place (if getting blind is what I want to do), and I can do it in an unsafe place.

The world can be nasty. I have to acknowledge this and work out a way to live in it with minimum injury to myself. That's my responsibility to myself,and to my family. No one else can do it for me.

It isn't always possible but I can do my best to minimise the risks. Getting legless in unsafe environments is self destructive and life threatening behaviour, whether you're male or female.

Not to mention the damage you might do to somebody else while you're in that state, and the millions spent on dealing with the damage caused by blind drunk people, and the awful task it is for police medics etc to have to deal with them. So it's a broad social responsibility for both genders, as well as personal.
Jennifer