PALE

I sense some conflict amongst the various animal welfare groups and your own and realise you are disappointed with their lack of support.

However, I believe this reluctance to assist you with your crusade in your proposals for reform in our abbatoirs is simply due to a difference in ideologies.

Those groups you have mentioned support vegetarianism and I believe participation in your crusade would conflict with their philosophies and their terms of reference.

These groups do not support the exploitation of animals for human purposes or the systematic oppression of one species by another. Therefore, they would no doubt view abbatoirs as repugnant and perceive any association as a conflict of interest.

I also understand that some group members have expressed concern over Australia's biodiversity where some 406 million hectares of land mass in Australia (that's 57 percent) is now taken by the animal grazing industry.

This figure does not include the land mass used to grow export feedstock or crops to feed our own factory farmed animals.

I see much merit in your own tireless endeavours but also endorse the endeavours of those other groups mentioned.

Despite the lack of cohesion between PALE and other groups, I would be happy to see a bipartisan approach to lobbying against Costello's latest ploy to gag the fair-minded citizens of this country.

This Bill has the potential to erode all manners of free speech over many unjust issues. Animal welfare groups will not be the only ones Mr Costello intends to silence.

fester, as I read it the researcher would able to release any results without fear under this proposed law. The freedom of speech is intact (subject as always to libel laws). The research, or any view for that matter, can be put forward. It is then up to the customer to decide on how to act on that information.

The creation of barriers between customers and suppliers is, in my opinion, the target of this bill. Not stifling information.
ie dickie can tell me eating meat is bad for my health. I can choose then to accept or reject this info.
What dickie won't be able to do, with impunity, is stand out the front of the local butchers with his 15 mates waving placards, or whatever. If their campaign is effective (the customer is intimidated and doesn't approach the shop) the ACCC can sue for lost business. Seems fair enough to me.

Rojo

Those who are reduced to the ad hominem circumstantial generally do so from mistaken assertions and a limited ability for sensible debate. The cap fits you nicely.

A secondary boycott need only involve 2 or more persons acting in concert which prevents a third party, such as a potential customer or supplier from dealing with or doing business with the target.

Your claim that "the freedom of speech is intact" is also incorrect. The "target" can make application to the ACCC for representation and it appears that if the ACCC's case is successful only the defendant will be required to meet any legal costs plus any compensation to the "target."

One need not resort to "stand(ing) out the front of his local butchers with 15 of his mates waving placards, or whatever" to become a victim of the ACCC's increased powers, as you inanely claim!

Dickie
I hear you. I have always respected your thoughts and value them highly.
Lets just stop for a moment. Here we both are supporting the issue of freedom of speech.
Yet I am unsure if you know or understand the policies of the others.
Yes I know they are Veggies and there is NOTHING wrong with that either. However these people control members and branches with an iron fist.
If they really want to help the animals there is but ONE WAY in which to do it!
Take control of the industry. If only I could have had you sit in on some of the meetings we have had with heads of big overseas countries and Government reps.

We invited them over and over again.

You have Russian business men amoung many others from different countries that would love to set up free Range Pork Farms and poulty farms.
Dont believe the Government when they say Muslims insist on Ritual Slaughter.
Sure some do but there are others who a quite modern in their way of thinking who were happy to put in gas.

Also it wasnt just meat we were doing but huge veggie farms and setting up fast food stores to compete with McDonaldals selling ALL Alternative products grown on their farms.

Clearly thats a huge project to take over Australia BUT it was on the table and we just needed their support.

They were Not interested. I will say it again Dickie - not Interested.
Dont you think they could have at least attended some of the meetings they were invited to?
Instead they blocked our membership of WSPA and sent emails out NOT TO TALK TO PALE.
So I am wondering- Are they SERIOUS about improving Animal Welfare to knock back such a good programe without so much as allowing us to meet with them?
Surely they can see its getting worse- not better.
Or are they just all political fund raisers. Sorry if I offend you .
Thats NOT my intention but really who said veggie groups ran and spoke for Australian`s anyway:?

Pale,
Sorry but I missed your point about the wrongdoings of PETA.
Any articles published by them clearly expose the atrocities of animal farming and in a highly graphic way.
Surely this is homogenous with your way of thinking.
Am I a bit naive but are ALL farmers as cruel to their animals as PETA exposes or are there some humane farming practices that do exist in Australia.
I do know that after viewing PETA's article on slaughter practices I only had some nice steamed veggies for dinner.

Godess, the question is, do you really believe everything that Peta
puts on their website as gospel? If so why? Clearly they have
an agenda to stop people eating meat. Even your dogs should apparently
turn to carrots and peas etc.

Peta clearly have a record of not letting the truth get in the way
of a good story, whilst they ask for your donation.

I mean, ever right here, our resident Peta fan, Dickie, cannot
answer my simple question as to when "chunks of flesh" are removed
from merino lambs at mulesing. Yet this claim is made over and over
by Peta.

Believe whatever you want, but just make sure that you are not
just another gullible sucker. Unless of course, you don't have
a problem with that.