Have you ever seen subliminal advertizing?

"The question I would like to ask is whether using methods such as these to send messages to consumer that they are not consciously aware of, is this ethically and morally appropriate? Is it ok to take advantage of the vulnerabilities in our subconscious minds? Some argue that it is unethical as we cannot choose to avoid the message we are being presented as we are not even aware that it is being delivered while others argue that as long as the unconscious message has the same intent as the conscious message there is nothing unethical about subliminal advertising (Klosterman 2014). There are also many others who are of the pinion that hidden subliminal messages used in advertising do not work in the first place."
http://alyssanash.wordpress.com/2014/04/10/the-use-of-embeds-in-adverstising/

I can see them usually and the commonest is the word "sex", usually embeded in the focal point of an add or near to it.

Advertising is immoral, regardless whether it is overt or covert.

Polluting minds with superfluous desires to buy things, is no different to polluting the air we breath and the water we drink.

If we have inborn desires to obtain certain goods or services, then well and good, we could then look it up and see how to get them, but inducing innocent others to desire more things, is plainly a crime. If that is done overtly then it should be considered as an assault and if that is done covertly, then I think that even by the existing criminal code this could be counted as theft.

It's all crap these days.

You'll see an ad for a product or a service of some sort,
But the ad itself will not even mention the product or service.
It will just be all some politically correct agenda instead.

I do not care for any of this, and am generally insulted by it.
Do not preach your social or political positions.

If I am forced to watch, then sell me on the merits of the product or service only.
A good quality product at a value for money price that will does what it says it does, guaranteed.
Above that if you make me laugh, then that's a bonus for which I may be more likely to remember you more.

The most important thing to know about subliminal advertising is: it doesn't work very well. Indeed it's a bit unclear whether it works at all!

______________________________________________________________________________

Yuyutsu,
If a business makes a product that can improve our lives, why shouldn't it be able to alert us to that?

I just offered up 'advertizing' to the all-USA system, and was asked "did you mean advertising?". I have never seen the word spelt with a zed, by anyone, anywhere.

Dear Aidan,

«If a business makes a product that can improve our lives, why shouldn't it be able to alert us to that?»

Being assaulted does not improve our lives.
Sowing unsolicited desires in the minds of others is an assault.
Desires do not make us happy.
How to deal with our existing desires, of which we already have plenty, is a whole huge topic and science by itself, but certainly the last thing we need is further new cravings invading our mind through our senses.

Now anyone who has a need for something should be able to look up (both online and offline) solutions to satisfy their need. Businesses that provide goods and services which others may need, should place the information about what they offer and how to find them in appropriate mediums where those with the corresponding need can seek them, but without exposing this to others who never asked for that information. The need can be specific or general in nature, but not as vague as "I want to be happy", because others cannot do it for us.

ttbn,

You didn't look far enough.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_of_desire

"In philosophy desire has been identified as a philosophical problem in realising the highest state of human nature 'Moksh'. In Plato's The Republic, Socrates argues that individual desires must be postponed in the name of the higher ideal.

Within the teachings of Buddhism, craving is thought to be the cause of all suffering. By eliminating craving, a person can attain ultimate happiness, or Nirvana."

david f,

On OLO remove the 's' from https and the link comes up ready for use.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_of_desire

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_of_desire

Is Mise,

Did I not? Are you going to tell me where I should have looked. I would be very interested to know where I should have looked, and who committed such an atrocity - particularly as an American spell check rejected it.

With regard to your subject, intelligent people don’t get gulled by subliminal advertising.

Yuyutsu your ideology blinds you to real life.

Much of the stuff I use to make the things I do easier, or even possible I learnt about from advertising. Most of this advertising was in magazines or on the net, I don't watch TV very often, & only listen to radio when driving, but advertising none the less.

I recently spent some time helping a friend source a mobility scooter. It was only from advertising on web sites that we found the best product for her needs. The couple of retailers we visited had none of the type most suitable for an elderly lady living on acreage, & almost no information on them.

With out advertising we would never have known what was available.

Yuyutsu,
>Sowing unsolicited desires in the minds of others is an assault.
No it isn't. Assault is threatening to cause injury. Sowing unsolicited desires in the minds of others does not threaten to cause injury.

>Desires do not make us happy.
Fulfilling them can.

> Now anyone who has a need for something should be able to look up
>(both online and offline) solutions to satisfy their need.
But what if they don't know they have a need? Unseen problems are still problems; what's wrong with presenting solutions?

ttbn,

"If you're writing for British readers, you should only use British spellings. In one or two cases, the preferred American spellings are acceptable in British English as well, especially the -ize/-ization endings. While you can use both the -ise/-isation or the -ize/ization endings in British English, it's important to stick to one style or the other throughout the same piece of writing."

http://www.lexico.com/grammar/british-and-spelling

How do you know that intelligent people don't get influenced by subliminal advertizing?

There must be some merit in using it or advertizers wouldn't pay the money to have it done.

I have before me the October 2020 free recipe book from one of our leading supermarket chains and it is loaded with subliminal embeds.

ttbn what ever you do, don't ever try firefox browser.

Their spell check tries to put a Z every where we use an S. It is infuriating.

Hi Is Mise,

I'm not sure how effective subliminal advertising
really is. It might work once, but if the product
turns out to be crap - people won't bother buying it
again.

Sure, it might suck you in at first - but unless it
lives up to its promise - it won't last for very long.
I have to admit that we got sucked in with the brand of
toilet paper - " Quilton". Which is softer and stronger
than the others. So it delivered. We've tried others
but they're thinner and not as soft. So folks, if you
have a problem with your bum - buy "Quilton". Çause
"Quliton Loves Your bum!"
(joke).

Is Mise,

Thanks, but unless I missed something, there is nothing to say that anyone but you has ever put a zed (zee if you prefer) in the word advertising. I'm sure that if you find otherwise, you will let me know:).

How do I know intelligent people are not influenced by subliminal advertiSing? Simple: anyone who is influenced by it is not intelligent. Subliminal advertiSing is simply not subliminal to intelligent people. It sticks out a mile.

And, of course there is merit in using subliminal advertiSing for people wanting to flog stuff because millions of people are, unfortunately, not intelligent enough to recognise it.

Hasbeen,

I'm often infuriated. I use Google Docs on a tablet for much of my typing, and that of course is always trying to correct my Australian/English spelling. Just as infuriating is 'predictive text' which presumes to know what I'm going to say next.

However, the only thing my rage changes is my blood pressure

Dear Hasbeen,

When you look in magazines, it is true that you may find what you want or need, but you are unfortunately also exposed and tempted to purchase many types of products that you never wanted, whose absence in your life never bothered you. Besides wasting your time, seeing these products sows seeds of new desires in your mind, some of which might even sprout into major addictions.

Your lady friend needed an appropriate form of transportation:
if she knew that she is after a scooter, then she could simply search for "scooter", otherwise she could search for "vehicles for special needs".
Ideally, if product-information was organised to favour the true needs of consumers over the greed of producers, then your lady would have so many more options. She could for example describe her problem along with her constraints and limitations to both robots and humans, which could then furnish an answer much quicker in the form of her mobility scooter, without exposing her on the way to so much other junk.

If your objective is to make your life easier, then it may help you to research within, focus and ask yourself exactly which area(s) of life do you find inappropriately difficult. Once you are clear about it, then it should be easy to obtain specific advice(s) whether any products or services can make these areas of life easier for you without paying too much in ways that might disturb you in other areas.

---

Dear Aidan,

«Assault is threatening to cause injury.»

Or causing an actual injury!

Sowing unsolicited new desires in one's mind is an injury to that person.

«>Desires do not make us happy.
Fulfilling them can.»

Because it heals a gaping wound.
Wouldn't it be better if the victim was not wounded to begin with?

[continued...]

[...continued]

Also, fulfilling desires has its costs. Some of these costs are:

* the time it takes, at the expense of other things.
* financial costs, so one has to work extra hours to get the money, costing more time and often creating frustrations and compromising one's health, then one requires new forms of "compensation" for their hard/unpleasant/unhealthy work.
* when one hurts other people in order to fulfill their desire as quickly as they can. This will bounce back and cause more guilt and suffering rather than happiness.
* until the desire is fulfilled, frustration and anger can arise, also jealousy against others who already have that desire fulfilled.
* once the desire is fulfilled, pride and arrogance can arise in that achievement, then when the glow fades, emptiness and boredom set in and one is tempted to adopt new desires to provide them with similar thrills.

«But what if they don't know they have a need? Unseen problems are still problems; what's wrong with presenting solutions?»

Nothing, but why flood someone, besides the actual solution(s) to their need(s), with so much other, disturbing and irrelevant, information? Further, why inflict such disturbing information on others who do not even have a need?

Yes, those who are not yet aware of their problems should be encouraged to introspect and find them. This requires focusing, not spreading out to receive tons of random information from all directions in hope that one splinter may raise our awareness to some unseen problem.

The commerce platforms should be supporting ordinary people rather than the greed of producers. Part of that is to provide step-by-step problem-solving assistance and encourage people to search within what their needs truly are. Once people state their exact needs and problems, it should be easy to provide them with the most appropriate solutions, the simpler needs by robots and the more complex ones by human professional experts.

Does subliminal advertising play a part in political
campaigns?

Can anyone think of any examples that attracted your
attention?

For example a candidate standing on a podium bearing
several national flags. Or photo shoots taken with
smiling children, or working with life-savers or
fire-men. Surely that sends a message to voters.
Or posing in church singing, or posing outside a church
with a Bible?

A lot of advertising is competitive - one company trying to convince us that their product is better than their rival's. This is the essence of capitalism; if there was just one government monopoly producing a product, they wouldn't need to advertise, we'd have no choice. Wouldn't that be communism? So I am somewhat surprised at the outrage of those usually conservative / right wing posters about an essential element of capitalism, business competition.

Foxy,

That is not subliminal advertizing, it's right out in the open.

Subliminal is the example before me of a trussed-up and cooked chicken on Coles' current recipe book with 'sex' embedded; remember the old adage "Sex Sells"

ttbn,

I've shewn embeds to many very intelligent people and they can't consciously see them.

Try:http://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/sentences-with-the-word/advertize.html

Is Mise,

I don't know anything about your ability to judge intelligence, so we should probably leave that bit alone. I'm more interested in in hearing who else but you spells advertising with a zed.

Yuyutsu,
>Or causing an actual injury!
No, that's battery! But they often go together.

>Sowing unsolicited new desires in one's mind is an injury to that person.
No it isn't - at least not usually. An arguable exception is when fulfilling those desires is harmful

>Because it heals a gaping wound.
You wrongly assume the gaping wound to be the desire itself. In reality the gaping wound is often unaddressed because it's unrecognised.

>Wouldn't it be better if the victim was not wounded to begin with?
Complete absence of desire is stagnation; not a heathy state at all!

>Also, fulfilling desires has its costs.
Yes it does, and people can (and do) judge for themselves whether the benefits are worth the cost. You seem to want to deny that comparison to those who don't actively look for it.

>why flood someone, besides the actual solution(s) to their need(s), with so much other, disturbing and
> irrelevant, information? Further, why inflict such disturbing information on others who do not even have a need?
The world is full of disturbing and irrelevant information. Advertising is trivial in this regard - the news is far worse!

> Yes, those who are not yet aware of their problems should be encouraged to introspect and find them.
But how would they know they're not yet aware of their problems, and what makes you think introspecting would result in them being found?

> The commerce platforms should be supporting ordinary people rather than the greed of producers.
The economic system based on satisfying "the greed of producers" has produced spectacular results; certainly much better than any alternative system. I see no advantage in trying to replace it with something based on introspective need!

I spell it advertising if I expect mainly Australians to read it. I spell it advertizing if I expect mainly Americans to read it.

ttbn,

"How to use advertize in a sentence"

http://www.wordhippo.com/what-is/sentences-with-the-word/advertize.html

ttbn,

Here's anothery,

"Lexic.us

Definition of Advertizer
1. Noun. Someone whose business is advertising.

Exact synonyms: Adman, Advertiser
Specialized synonyms: Huckster, Booster, Plugger, Promoter, Tout, Touter
Generic synonyms: Publiciser, Publicist, Publicizer
Derivative terms: Advertise, Advertize

http://www.lexic.us/definition-of/advertizer

Dear Aidan,

«No, that's battery! But they often go together.»

Interesting! I was not aware of this.

However, I do not speak legalese, nor did I even attempt to suggest what the law should be. Rather, I was using common English to speak of morality, simply saying: "Look friend, this is bad, it hurts people".

Many actions are legal yet immoral, but so it should remain because I wouldn't appoint government to guard morality any more than I would appoint a cat to guard the cream.

«No it isn't - at least not usually. An arguable exception is when fulfilling those desires is harmful»

My neighbour has a tree which keeps dropping shoots in my yard.
Every spring I have to chase and pull out those droppings lest they grow into unwanted big trees. Some of these shoots land in hidden spots such as under my bushes, so it requires a careful daily search. I am still capable of gardening and pull them out diligently, but I rather spend my time in other ways. Other people may be too young, old, sick, ignorant or busy to weed their gardens.

Earlier I differentiated between pre-existing desires and new ones. How to deal with existing desires is beyond the scope of this discussion, although I am grateful to David F. for introducing the philosophical and Buddhist aspects.

In analogy, what I plant in my own garden could perhaps also be harmful, but here I only address uncalled-for seeds and roots that come from my neighbour's yard.

«You wrongly assume the gaping wound to be the desire itself. In reality the gaping wound is often unaddressed because it's unrecognised.»

And it remains unrecognised because people are too busy handling heaps of new junk-information.

«Complete absence of desire is stagnation; not a heathy state at all!»

And nobody suggested it: there is a fine line between desires and cravings. Ideally, one would have the former but not the latter.

[continued...]

[...continued]

«people can (and do) judge for themselves whether the benefits are worth the cost.»

Which indeed they should.
But one's time on earth is precious, we generally have not enough time to sort out even our own deep-rooted accumulated desires, so having to also sort out new outside-temptations would be an unnecessary Sisyphean task.

«You seem to want to deny that comparison to those who don't actively look for it.»

What I want is to protect people who are happily busy with whatever is already meaningful in their lives from having to waste their precious time on weeding the neighbours' shoots.

For those who want comparisons, looking for what they want should actually become simpler. At the moment they are flooded instead with mountains of information that is irrelevant to their situation.

I would like comparisons to become simpler and faster, and I believe that they will, if the system was designed to provide service to consumers rather than profits for producers.

«The world is full of disturbing and irrelevant information. Advertising is trivial in this regard - the news is far worse!»

Hard to tell which is worse, it is quite personal. Anyone should be able to live their own life while keeping away from either or both to whatever extent they wish.

«But how would they know they're not yet aware of their problems, and what makes you think introspecting would result in them being found?»

I am not saying that introspection will always find everything - for some it could take more than a lifetime, but experience shows that people who introspect discover existing problems and issues on a daily basis.

«The economic system based on satisfying "the greed of producers" has produced spectacular results; certainly much better than any alternative system.»

Perhaps for the producers or the GDP, but not for the helpless mass of consumers. While there may be more to buy (though of lesser quality and endurance), life for most has become stressful, unhealthy and futile. Happiness was not achieved this way.

The Left has been using this tactic for a long time !

Posted by Cossomby, Wednesday, 4 November 2020 5:29:10 PM

A lot of advertising is competitive - one company trying to convince us that their product is better than their rival's. This is the essence of capitalism...(otherwise) communism? So I am somewhat surprised at the outrage of those usually conservative / right wing posters about an essential element of capitalism, business competition.

Answer- Good point Cossomby. Encouraging honesty consistency- which is lacking. Ayn Rand would agree with you- as a warning against Communism.

However Capitalism and Communism are not the only options on the "spectrum of societies structure". I favour Traditionalism- in Traditional societies people are aware of the goods and services available within the community without advertising by word of mouth. Perhaps all Advertising is Subliminal Advertising- as is all communication- in a sense.

I've been occasionally surprised at how I and others have been subtly influenced by sophisticated public relations campaigns. Those without principles are sucked in by the turbulence of concentric cascading cyclones of competing PR campaigns. Even aware I spend large amounts of time untangling myself from tricky philosophy.

Mass Culture is an interesting phenomena- Capitalism and Communism are both heavily influenced by mass culture. Perhaps what people are reacting to is the overwhelming complexity and threat of mass culture.

Zoologist Desmond Morris commented alienation is inevitable- The Human Zoo (Tribes vs Super-Tribes).

Many of the so called Conservative people on this forum are perhaps not "right" in the referred sense.

Political theorists advocate multiple dimensions- not just left and right. (I've seen more than four dimensions at play in the various political situations. Difficult to draw four dimensions on a two dimensional paper. Objectively Michell substitutes the word "communitarian" for "totalitarian".)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_spectrum

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_spectrum#Mitchell:_Eight_Ways_to_Run_the_Country

"From the four main political traditions, Mitchell identifies eight distinct political perspectives diverging from a populist center. Four of these perspectives (Progressive, Individualist, Paleoconservative, and Neoconservative) fit squarely within the four traditions; four others (Paleolibertarian, Theoconservative, Communitarian, and Radical) fit between the traditions, being defined by their singular focus on rank or force. "

How many of you can see the subliminal embeds in magazines etc?