"Germany does place a higher value on supply reliability than most nations". Spoken like one who thinks reliability should be tradable for emissions reductions. It's not how modern civilization works, but neo-Malthusians don't want modern civilization.

Forgot about the Swedes and Swiss, so thanks for the reminder. These add to the point that after absolutely humongous expense and interconnection with non-emitting sources Germany has achieved nothing on its own more than flat-lining emissions and huge consumer costs. My statement about a theoretical 100% contingency does seems excessive, I suppose, as it has only been needed up to 90% capacity in a real event,so far (24 Jan 2017):
http://docs.wind-watch.org/Hidden-consequences-intermittent-electricity-production.html

The battery cost is easy enough to find by Googling the sleuthing done to find it, not information from an open and accountable government, initially at least. The battery is only to delay blackouts, or, some profitable arbitrage enabled by the destructive disruption of the market caused by the RET. Actual grid-storage, were it batteries or anything else, would blow SA off the economic map.

So, when will Germany, and SA, cease renewables virtue-signalling while relying on baseload sources for firming that lie beyond their borders? If grid-storage is so feasible why does Germany build coal instead, and why did SA install an expensive fleet of diesel generators that cost a monza to run?

Saltpetre enjoying your posts always have
It interests me seeing how conservatives always try to crucify Labor for caring
For redistributing money to help those truly in need
To put an end to tax breaks for hosts of people who pay no tax
Your mob do hand outs to, but to such as Rupert the rat and other tax avoiders
As well as blacken our national broadcaster, what is that about? crippling an opponent
Or softening one up so as to buy it cheap [claims have become truth here so let me use it too]Did Rupert arrive in Canberra the very week Turnbull was dumped?Is a vote for Scomo one for Rupert?

Forgot the The shrinking pie.

Labor's energy policy will make Oz less competitive unless cost of compliance is subsidized for exporters by the rest of us, which is what happens in Germany. The pie effectively shrinks as each person's share of it is offset by their share of the cost of any such subsidy through the higher power prices they'll pay.

Trumps war on China is ensuring our exporters will have a hard time of it regardless of energy policy. With lower national income the pie shrinks. We need the cheapest energy possible to reduce costs to exporters, while reducing emissions.

As we near the big day we see the water has become very muddy
Well it will get worse, save the next ten days of the Gutter press, one day they will be worth money
All is possible from the mob who tapped even the Royals phones
Just a little more concern is on display from the walking Smirk scomo As he tries to get Bill to say something he, and his boss Rupert can use
After all he dare not run on policy,he has not one to tell us about

Dear Belly and Foxy,

I don't mean to be too hard on Labor, particularly considering some of the real improvements achieved by Labor for so many doing it tough - as well as for Oz citizens and the national future generally - including with NDIS and three essential Royal Commissions - and I include Banking and Aged and Disability care with Child Sexual Abuse in this, as Labor has truly been instrumental in getting these underway - and thanks Foxy for pulling me up on some of the worthwhile achievements of Julia in particular.

One thing though, on the economic front, I really think the considerable net national budget surplus and the Future Fund established under Howard/Costello, and inherited by Kevin and Julia, surely went a long way in recession-proofing Oz during the GFC.

Could the national purse have been better utilised during the crisis - say for public housing rather than cash-for-clunkers, pink batts and over-priced (and even unnecessary) school halls? Maybe.

And, as for climate change, Foxy, I can only reiterate my view (and the unblemished scientific view), that Oz' net contribution to Greenhouse is almost infinitesimal - and that's without taking into account the sequestration going on over large areas of untouched forest and bushland as we speak.

Sure I'm in favour of more renewables and sustainable alternatives to the use of fossil fuels - which are finite anyway, and oil is getting very much harder to source already. But does that mean we have to clear and burn our forests/bush to plant oil palms, the way Indonesia has done (to the expense of endangering the Orang, and contributing a huge boost to greenhouse - such that aviation had to be diverted because of the huge smoke haze?

So many issues, and so little time.

Continued:

Sure, there is good reason to go electric, but Oz is a land of sweeping plains, and electric just won't cut it for everyone.
Sure, we could build some massive solar farms, wind farms and hydro - but intensive industry (like aluminium smelting) depends on massive base-load which currently can only be supplied from coal or gas-fired power stations - and not solar, wind or hydro can match that (at least not without huge storage capacity and an enormous upgrading of electricity distribution infrastructure (with attendant cost and fire and health hazard potentials). And, have we forgotten about the health impacts of living, working, playing in proximity to high voltage power lines?

Are we to sacrifice Oz' industrial development capacity to the solar god, particularly while Trump, Putin, Xi and so many others are bent on world domination - at any cost??

One day Oz will probably have to go nuclear anyway, for intensive continuous base-load - it can be safe, and Oz has masses of uranium. (Though thorium may be a better option - if we had any).

As for Bill, he spruiks a lot of economic redistribution and high ideals, but I can't help feeling there's a lot of vote hunting in what he proposes, but not so much of an overall plan and vision. (Good ideas on cancer treatment and dental care of course, but I'm not a great believer in pushing education at kids who need time to bloom with mum and/or dad.)

Mind you, Morrison's plans don't seem to be all that visionary either, and I'm not keen on his one of the blokes general demeanor, but at least he is not rocking what is, and has been, a fairly smooth sailing craft.

Good luck to all, and more power to you.