The only place the Quran will take the believers is to a religious straitjacket that closes the human mind to logical thought. I think the whole faith needs a serious revamp to take it into the 21st century. It seems incapable of surviving in any society apart from those where the education system is focussed on sustaining a faith and not education.

stevenlmeyer: it's quite simple. Your understanding of foreign policy is inadequate. To you it apparently means something friendly diplomatic relations. Here are a couple of examples.

Has a foreign government sent agents to overthrow our federal parliament and meddle in internal affairs?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Ajax

Has your family been wiped out of existance by foreign bombs indiscriminately? That includes your precious, little kiddies too. Have major cities such as Sydney been ruined and turned to rubble?

List of victims and ages on the right panel,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haditha_massacre#Killings_and_immediate_aftermath
"In the latest of a series of attacks causing significant civilian casualties in recent weeks, more than 200 were killed by coalition troops in Afghanistan in June, far more than are believed to have been killed by Taliban militants."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/afghanistan/story/0,,2115859,00.html

We are killing more innocent people than the Taliban. Wow. But that's ok, isn't it? We can kill as many as we want can't we.

Perhaps if a foreign power created a new country within Australia, by taking most of the Eastern coast and declaring it the new Aboriginal country, Australians would accept it gladly and relinquish all that land and political influence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

This is a fraction of what has occured in the Middle East in recent history. Apparently the prior link I posted from the CIA expert was more or less ignored or dismissed. The ignorance of the average Westerner is shameful.

Finally here is a last tiny gem from Madeleine Albright, who represents the US foreign policy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lK_QshS2EW8

kactuz, "The vile, evil accounts in Islam do not bother them."

And the vile, evil accounts in Christianity not do not bother you or anyone else. The point of me posting http://www.evilbible.com was to expose the hypocrisy of a Christian who finds crimes in the holy texts of Islam. It is a pot calling a kettle black, situation.

Belly,
I'm actually not from the Muslim community and I am in no way defending evil.
All I'm interested in is maintaining some degree of perspective.
What seems to be happening here is that people are using evil to fight evil. In order to win, our evil must have to be worse than their evil, our lies have to be worse than their lies.

The gist of BD's (among others) strategy is to simply accuse Islam's spiritual leader of being a criminal pedophile and ALL its followers of being misguided, violent, potential terrorists and bent on World domination.
I presume they either want to make them all see the light and abandon Islam or to simply leave all non-Muslim countries and go "home". Either way they are seen as not welcome here. No exceptions, even for those who have lived here peacefully and productively for generations.

Is this how you win the hearts and minds of your perceived enemies? Is this how you hope to cultivate anti-terrorist informants from their community?

This reminds me of the sort of people who walk up to a wasp nest with a stick in one hand and a can of fly-spray in the other and later complain when they get stung. (Or certain kickboxer who has been known to dress up in paramilitary garb and behave provocatively in public. Jesus would be so proud of this messenger.)

I've also seen the ozpolitic.com forum mentioned above and it seems to be yet another haven for disaffected whining Hansonist "small-r" racists and not much different from what may allegedly be talked about in Mosques.More phoney self-righteous indignation without any practical solutions.

Somebody else makes all the decisions anyway but we can at least be aware of how they easily manipulate us through our emotions.

If it wasn't the Muslim boogey-man it would have to be something else.

Steven wrote;

>The interesting question is this. Why is it that in Western countries
>in 2007 it is from the Muslim communities that an ultra-violent
>reaction to perceived grievances is most likely to emanate?
>
>Is a violent reaction intrinsic to Islam?

>It seems clear that a violent reaction to perceived grievances is
>intrinsic to certain interpretations of Islam that are by no means
>marginal in 2007.

Have you noted as I have the exagerated reaction to any critism or
perceived insult ?

Is this not a behaviour problem ?
Can anyone tell me what is the attitude to cousin marriage in the Quoran?
How long has it been common practise ?

Steel,

There is nothing in your various links I have not read or heard before.

I infer from you last post that you believe British Muslims are justified in mounting a violent response to British policy.

I other words, I infer you believe the 7 / 7 bombings and the car bombs of this weekend are a justified.

Is that correct?