http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2013/07/19/11/25/turnbull-tension-in-coalition-albo
I am not, and never will be a Liberal voter.
But like many, find the lurch away from the birth place of their party some Liberals are not Liberals.
The link is stunning, and for me frightening.
Because of it I hope the election as called this Sunday, for next month.
But on the long trudge from loss in 2007 till now the Liberals , or its current leaders seem to have taken several leaps, away from their base.
Just as sure as when I called for Labors leadership change, I think Turnbull is the single hope for true Liberalism.
Will he however be returned before the election or after it?
Some things have moved under Abbott,s feet, they make it a hard task for him to lead a return to his party,s once base.
Like it or not ETS is going to come our way, Turnbull would tell us that in his first ten minutes in leadership.
We must not fail to understand middle path voters swing to both sides, often, and Abbott seems unable to be reason to jump ship.

Come off it Belly.

Surely you have not looked at your mob recently

A party controlled by lefty academics, lefty women's Libbers, criminal union bosses, & inner city latte drinkers has very little in common with the one you joined all those years ago. Just look at the effeminate interpreter you have elected as your leader. Chiefly must be spinning.

The libs, as long as they get rid of the trendies like Turnbull, who have taken over your party, are a damn sight closer to their roots than Labor

Dear Hasbeen,

John Hewson, Malcolm Fraser, Nick Minchin,
and even Joe Hockey (and if the truth be
known, Julie Bishop, and many others) - don't agree
agree with your take of things. Very few actually
wanted Tony Abbott as leader. It was a fluke the man
got the job at all (by one vote). Even he didn't
expect to win.

So stop blowing hot air. Nobody's
buying it - or taking your crowd seriously any more.
And now that you guys can't coast along on
condemnation anymore - and are being held to
scrutiny - you're coming up empty. The PM's only
been back a short time - and he's achieved a great
deal. When's Mr Abbott going to show us what the
Coalition has to offer? He has to do more than just
keep breathing to get elected.

Hasbeens post Lexi, with some force is nothing other than evidence he does not understand Labor, or his party.
Labor is not, has not four plus, decades, been lefty controlled.
Those charges make sense ONLY in noting the claimant is far right.
Mark my words Abbott is only the temporary leader of his party.
His removal will give every chance for true Liberalism to again control his party.
In putting forward a view about politics we MUST remember, our views may not be the views of many or most, and yes me too, we may well be wrong.
Any one intent on ignoring the numbers who currently support Turnbull, and understanding the polls point to many within the Liberals, who too do not want Abbott.
Our personal pain/ bitterness/ green eyed jealousy, will not impact on any election.
Voters have shown , many times they are indifferent to the extremes left or right, home of the Liberals under Abbott.
Common sense tells us to hear the voice of the voters not our own wants and wishes.

Dear Belly,

After watching "Q and A," a few weeks
ago when Malcolm Turnbull was a guest on the panel
it was obvious how popular he is with voters. And as
others within his party ranks have stated - he is
more popular than Abbott within his own party.
It would be interesting to have him challenge
Abbott for the leadership. However, I doubt if Mr
Abbott would go quietly for the sake of the Party,
as Gillard did.

I remember the Liberal Party that my parents voted
for. How different the current one seems today.
Unrecognisable in fact. Still, hopefully there
are still a few good souls out there who also
cringe at the direction that Mr Abbott has taken the
Party. It's a shame they don't speak up - and are
allowing it to degnerate to the mess it's in currently.
Elders like - John Hewson, and Malcolm Fraser - should
be listened to.

Belly,

You must be Tony Abbott's No1 fan. You regularly start threads about him and post many replies, even where no-one else has posted.

That would make Lexi Abbott's No2 fan. Shucks.

You've both got Tony in your head. It is an obsession. LOL

Belly old mate, if anyone doesn't understand Labor, it is those silly enough to think what calls itself Labor today, has some resemblance to the old party you joined.

Lexi my sweet, the only people who would stand for Turnbull are lefties, or those who have not actually listened to what he says, just how he say's it.

The same sure goes for Rudd, & that fool Obama. The west will be lucky to survive much more of this stupidity.

Dear Hasbeen,

You know flattery works with me - you silver fox.

However, I've heard Hewson and others interviewed
on television and they've all spoken in glowing
terms on Turnbull. Even Nick Minchin wanted
Turnbull as leader originally - except that
Turnbull wouldn't back down on the ETS - (man of
principle) and therein was the problem.

OTB it is with great assurance I say no need exists to reply to your post.
Not to ignore it, but to know you understand very little about the subject.
Hasbeen the thread is not about Labor.
You along with many others know only too well how to insult Labor and tilt at windmills.
A morning spent reading the speeches and policy,s of Sir Robert Menzies, then comparing them to todays party would be informative.
Sir Bob, would cringe in the corner at both the policy,s and the words of Abbott,s front bench.
Free enterprise and much more has suffered in this leaders watch, his intention to cut benefits to the less well off, and reward mums earning $150.000 a year, with 6 months full pay?
Informed posters know both majors have moved to the right.
Labors was to fill empty ground vacated by Liberals.
Yet so,me within that party are still Liberals and unhappy ones as Abbott drags you all to a very dirty water hole.
We, most of us, know what became of a certain sheep at a water hole.

Turnbull is the man of the moment "given a chance"
The world of Neo Liberalism has got lots to answer for. It's not for AU.
We need middle ground, so everyone can share the profits. Abbott is far to one sided, and i suspect a radical willing to take notice of Newman.
QLD solved nothing, just shifted the furniture. Which is what Abbott would do.
The agreement between Rudd and New guinea is very positive. I don't know if the same agreement would apply to Abbott and co. Liberalism is in hibernation ,but even their most loyal are willing to vote for a party with no policy, and a radical at the head.

Don't forget Lexi my sweet that Hewson was rejected because he was incompetent. A great technician, but not capable of carrying out the project.

Turnbull has shown himself to be equally incompetent. He may have been able to organize a phone company, but was a failure as opposition leader, not a great recommendation for PM.

He has also shown himself incapable of understanding even the job he was given, & can't handle technical information.

If we are going to have a no hoper, lets have the top no hoper, K Rudd.

Dear Hasbeen,

I think you're confusing Mr Abbott with Malcolm Turnbull.
Mr Abbott's the one who's not a "tech head,"
who Peter Costello described as an "economic illiterate."
Turnbull is tech savy, and his economic expertise is
highly respected. The following quote fits Mr Abbott
nicely:

"If ignorance ever goes to $40 a barrel I want drilling
rights to his head."

I can understand some posters not wanting to post in a thread I started.
After all my advocacy for a Rudd return, and Gillards dumping offended many,on both sides.
But the reply s I see so far, seem unaware that multi thousands of pages exist.
Inquiring in to why Liberals have moved so far right.
I too can not ignore Labor too has moved right.
Minority's constantly tell us both, Lib/Lab we deserted our roots.
Maybe so, but Labor today is [prove me wrong] 1960,s Liberal.
Am I blind? can others see that Liberalism as we see it today boarders on being too far right for its followers.
Rise in Party,s such as greens and Palmer/Katter jokes, harm the majority.
See how the next senate looks.
I understand my party has only just begun its reforms.
But this thread is about Liberalism.
Not intentionally, but thinking about it, this thread invites, as others I posted true Liberals to tell us if they are pleased with current direction of their party.
Reverting to stabbing Labor is , in my view saying we do not know or care about Liberalism.

http://theconversation.com/australian-liberalism-old-and-new-15692
Surely a talking point.
If not evidence others are wondering.
I thought we could have an intelligent talk about the good and the bad in todays Liberals.
If I am right, at some future date not too far away, 3 months max.
A new leader Turnbull best chance, will return them to solid ground.
And how funny it is to know!
Except a great deal of Labors policy rejected by this now lost bunch.

"The same sure goes for Rudd, & that fool Obama. The west will be lucky to survive much more of this stupidity."

Hasbeen I totally agree the quicker we get the Aussie wombat and Yankee wacko, Little Johnny Howard and George WubbleU Bush back to save the free world the better. If they are not available maybe we can resurrect Laurel and Hardy.
ROTFLMAO what a crack up!

Gday Paul, thought you may want to get down and dirty with me.
Not dirty actually, but involved in an intelligent thought provoking talk about Liberalism.
Do not get me wrong, open an ALP election center today, have over committed myself for whole campaign.
But even you at some level, must know truly Liberal Liberalism makes our job harder, some times imposable.
What would be ALP chances if a true Liberal party confronted us .
Abbott,s Liberalism his backing of Cory whats his name is far from Liberal.
His baby pay is just mad, while cutting welfare at the other end.
See the worlds refugee troubles with eyes wide open, then look at Abbott, see Carbon reduction world wide, watch the recent growth in country,s getting on board then hear Abbott .
Liberalism will return.
What however will they think of these days.

Belly, The founder of The Liberal Party was himself an arch conservative Bob Menzies. Many truly liberal minded people have found a home within the party John Gorton, famously said "I am a liberal, not a conservative." but these truly liberal thinking people have always been rather uneasy within the party, often at loggerheads with the stronger conservative element.
In recent years people like John Howard pushed the party to the right on both social justice and economic issues. This shift is partly in response to Labor's shift from left of center to a more right wing position under Hawke and Keating. Howard is a great admirer of Menzies, Abbott is a disciple of Howard's, enough said.
I find Turnbull more of a true Liberal than many within both his own party and the ALP. Turnbull is a prime example of someone with a true liberal philosophy and because of it has made many enemies within his own party.

I'm not sure if you are right about Turnbull being a true Liberal Paul. If he is that is a damn good reason to chuck him out on the scrap heap where such failed theories belong.

I believe Turnbull is a cross between a chancer, out for number one & number one [himself] only, & a would be dictator in a sheep skin camouflage.

In this he so closely resembles the disgusting Rudd, that he should be eliminated from public life, just as Rudd.

Here's an idea. Lets make them live in managers of the Manus boat people settlement. Most of our worst problems fixed in a single stroke.

Paul in calling Menzies an arch conservative, first compare him with todays Liberals.
Any party hoping to gain power best not live on the edges.
The lights on the hill are in the hands of grand children of those first owners, as a second or third home.
No wish exists to turn left or right for them.
I with my very heart, think Abbott and his tactics are in no way Liberal.
Todays news headline, and his words question both honesty and understanding.
The beat up that the newly announced boat people plan will not work.
That in saying what any country currently would and does, un wanted migrants will not be able to settle in PNG is a constructed lie, *and be honest* an attempt to sabotage the new plan, nothing less.
Abbott given his way, would keep the boats coming without doubt.

OK fair enough it did not get a roll on.
Think I was aiming too high.
And that my own contributions did not express my true though and meaning.
See I think, may be wrong, that for our country maybe America and England, the extremes will not work.
Labor has only just started its long trek to real reform.
And in my view a need exists,for the Liberal Party to plan its future.
Our angry words here, from our lofty thrones and self belief, will make zero difference come the election.
Bank on it.
But some true escapism,on both sides, from the reality, voters are not stupid, has turned our heads.
Liberalism in my view must ask how did it bring Cory Barnardy in to its ranks.
Remember it gave us Hansen.
And why are they, confronted by tax rises and cost cutting ,planning middle class welfare.
Room exists to question both sides of politics, *but not here* not in the forum*
Years of inviting debate, from my opponents has seen ? nothing.
Here in defense of a truth *Australia needs a strong Liberal party is ignored.
I am aware I burn my own bridges,on both sides,would not change for quids.
Are we however be coming just a group of howlers? yelling in print at each other.
I aimed too high I thought we could be honest, no party can ignoreits blemishes and prosper.
Should one become so strong it can not be defeated,it could rest on its laurels and decay.
NSW Labor past did that and it is a long way back.