belly/quote..""give this some thought.
Are your views always right.
Are mine always wrong""

clever 'redirection'..but we both been both

""Let us look at yours,..how many do you think
find smoking does not kill?""

i think every smoker knows*,,its not smomking
that he she will die of..but rotted teeth cancer/heart disease[YOU KNOWE ALL THEM NUMBERS ATTRIBUTABLE*..to smoking..BUT MATE lumping the lot together..DONT PROVE SMOKE LINKAGE>>.

just like not all suicides by gun..is by dads gun
simplistic over simplifuckation mate..ATTRIBUTABLE..mean atributed to smoking..but what they dun is lie!

the social cost..ISNT the medical cost[thats only 800 nillion cost of hospitalisation of all smoker..ATTRIBUTABLE..mate its spin..WHY>.cause some docter PRONOUNCED/declaredon the death papers SMOKING..as THE CAUSE of death..

when they wernt actually 'smoking'

its the same twisted logic of STEALING PEOPLES GUNS*
not paying..just straight out THEFT..

[quote]How many, by percentage smoke?[/quote]
the numbers of smokers WHO DIE OF CANCER
plus the numbers of NON SMOKERS who get cancer..is the same PROPORTIONS..regardless of smoking..thus smoking not the TRUE causwe[ie micro particul;ate./wood smoke low temp burn..causes cancers/plus pepper sray..and gunoil

[""..Guns, do you think the police took your guns out of spite?""

yes..5 raids they ignored it
but then they went in as an egsample*
big thugs..with guns..tazers dogs..for what a smoking dope

so much wasted police time
DEEMING a plant a drug..by lie

[quote]
did you say or do anything to make them think it was best to take them?[/quote]
yes i was questioning their expert..trained in one wekend..to judge a plant as a drug..went home and the came stayed 6 hours..8 cops..[lasst time it was just two..but this time they wanted pain

screw the lot of em
[quote]
You once told me you are an ex Biker, continues

belly cont..""did you in those ranks ever meet anyone who may have shot and killed some one, is that OK?[/quote]
mate..TILL HOLLYWOOD movies and gobvt scare propaganda got into its oppresive policing..,bikies just rode bikes!

i was the first official bike wedding..it wasnt then,...like its made to look now..gun shots,,wow..police have guns,,even have 'spare' guns..i seen the movies

i seen dirty harry and serpico
i read what went down in brissie/malbourne/sydney..heck we even murderd unionists warfies too..thugs the lot of em..but thyey got licence..
[quote]

Did you ever have a mate who shot himself,
[/quote]
no i got two dead drunks..and an 18 year old died in his own vomiit..on his 18th..

I HATE DRUNKS AND GUNS..[i did teq support for a foreign army..TRAINING at shoal water bay..35 dead..JUST PRACTICING for war

i did my time..i had the guns safe

now who knows some cop has maybe cut it down..WE DONT KNOW*
police bust druggies and the drugs get back on the streets..I DONT TRUST THOSE WHO RAPE ME ONCE[12 times

""" did you ever wish he had no gun,
that you could have spent just a few minutes with him till he calmed down.""

no idea what your talking about BUT..i recall a joke..from the first coppers that came to my home to steal plants..one said luckey you didnt try to run..[me handcuffed on my own front lawn said huh>..run..from my own home?

anyhow he finnished his joke...with ''cause our mates smith/western would have got ya..lthe fuc wit..its the same thugs with guns..i only found out decades later smiyth /wesern is a gun

thats what we get with cops with guns
spin..oh the por boy..NO VICTIM NO CRIME*

no autopsies are done to validate the fictions of 15,000 deaths
its based on hersay..LIES*..dont think god dont know juliar

i note time is called on the article of note
men and their beloved guns..yes just penus extentions..poor frightend little things needing a gun..mine were disabled..

not becvause i couldnt kill..but because i couldnt kill knowing i would have to face god to explain ..WHY i killed..life ANLY he can give to live

murder is specificly forbidden..the law reads thou shalt not murder
and thats what police with guns are doing...THINK..for a second

civil deaths has been rising in every theater of war
RISING STEADILY..from 2%..in ww1..to 6 %..in ww2..to as many as perhaps quater a million in iraq..

civil deaths..compared to what 5,000 ARMED deaths..
now we get to deaths of police..less than 10..this year
how many dead crims..50/50..or more like iran

SURE BAN GUNS
for all*..go through the world bying them back..and make them who made them pay for the buy back..but so easy to vilify miners and shoot them..copps with guns

you seen where that goes
16 dead unionists..a good beginning..killed by cops with guns

guns who needs em
but pay..both ways

Csteele, no leg pulling, great true wisdom in your post.
Before generalizing and before judging only on our views we should see the issues from all angles.
Generally, to even think just asking a few questions about guns, to check how they are kept, is wrong?
I can not find any common ground with Indy miss placed self confidence, Hasbeen,s self worth however seems to point to unhappiness deep and wide.
Right now I am living a real life possible murder suicide, knowing I try to help folk I know well approached me.
Two brothers in a life time war, this time because one thought the other should not have his child on the back of a farm bike.
Went for guns intent on? murder, guns had been removed and police arrived from 30 klm away in time to stop it.
To compare these events with human rights is the refuse to see truth.

I would merely reply with "BAHAHAHAHAHAHA" but, you know ... doesn't add to the convo.

I enjoy hunting more than I enjoy guns. But like with butchers using knives, it's the best tool for the job. I've hunted with dogs and knives, guns, bows, a camera, whatever, and weirdly - apparently - I sexually function normally. But, I guess, same with butchers you get to appreciate a decent tool - lol so to speak. You strive to purchase the best and of course during that process you discuss with other owners, buy mags, go to gun shops, and google them. The shooting range is a necessary thing for sighting your rifle and checking it's functioning the way it should before you head into the hills.

Think I'd call it an interest, before a sexual dysfunction.

Hasbeen,
I enjoy your posts and most often agree with you. However, on this occassion I believe you to be in the wrong.

O sung wu began by quoting what academics have said and then added, quote."Is this notion correct ? I don't know. However, may I relate an event I was involved in, before I retired...?"

He then went on to relate a suicide incident he experienced and raised the issue of why a father would want possesion of the firearm that his son used to kill himself. I cannot answer that and maybe there is no lodical answer. All I can do is put forward the things that attract me to my firearms. I can relate to what Stg said also.

Funny thing is that I think on 99% of the time you and he would agree, I think you misread his first post.

o sung wu,
You are spot on with your info about the .17 Remington. All I could add is a glass bedded barrel and an excellant scope and you have an extremely precise tool. As the projectiles are tiny, the reloading process is fiddly but powder was measured to within 1/10th of a grain, for consistancy.

As I said before the reasons for attraction for firearms is many. In my case it would be similar to admiring a top performing bike or car. It is an appreciation of an object well made and beautifully finished. Importantly, I can afford to own the firearm.