Dear Belly,

Thought you might have objected to the line;

"This Unknown Australian is not interred here to glorify war over peace; or to assert a soldier’s character above a civilian’s; or one race or one nation or one religion above another; or men above women; or the war in which he fought and died above any other war; or one generation above any that has been or will come later."

It was precisely the sentiment I was trying to convey in the previous thread.

His following line nails it for me.

"The Unknown Soldier honours the memory of all those men and women who laid down their lives for Australia. His tomb is a reminder of what we have lost in war and what we have gained."

Remembering only glories gained, or even mateships forged is only telling half the Anzac story. One must dwell also on the losses we suffered and as you said "the horrors of war".

OUG is doing just that. There would have been many a good union man in the Australian ranks at Gallipoli who would have been blood red with anger at the lives lost in a poorly thought out and executed campaign, one remembered for the poor leadership from upperclass twits who though nothing of sending good men to die in futile charges, one that resulted in the slaughter of thousands of our young men.

If only engaging in war as a complete last resort is not the legacy of their deaths then we dishonor them. We most certainly were the invaders/transgressors on that day and those who would get upset at that fact I feel need to ask themselves why.

There was no glory in the objectives of the campaign itself, as UOG points out those glories belong mainly to the other side, what mattered was that the sacrifices made by Australian troops were for each other and because of a pride in a new country. In the end the sense of shared loss among the loved ones at home, now hardly mentioned, was probably as defining for us a nation.

Japan went to war because the USA was limiting it's access to energy and trade.We warned the USA that they were about to attack Pearl Harbour.

They are currently trying to limit China's access to oil in Uganda and Sudan.We have sent special forces to Africa to implement Western Imperialism.WW3 is looming and the nutters are on our side.

csteele no I think you look for things I do not think in my ANZAC DAY thoughts.
I very much agree with every word.
And think it becomes the best post in this thread.
In my youth, bush camps by construction ext,I learned much by reading the history's of wars.
I am not unaware the German and British Royal family's, hence one family, needlessly started ww1.
Or the part jingoism played.
It does not lessen the fact, those dieing did so for us.
A day of first remembrance, those who celebrate do so against the culture and wishes of this country's RSL.
Australia, folk like you tell us, is a multi cultural country.
Then do not challenge my right to my culture.
I would rather your contribution, one I have already said is the best, than the side stepping rubbish we are seeing.
Wars have taken place, the deal are in their graves,this day is remembrance of them and the suffering.
If we forget history we are bound to let it happen today.
Less we Forget.

belly quote..""Then do not challenge my right to my culture.""

your culture..as a nuionist
your culture as a man[as husband father...ausie..brit jap jew?]

no one is challinging your right to culture

but war is barbaric

if the uniform you...comes into my home blastying as you come
throwing bombs unseen from the sky..[killing murdering plundering bombing civilisation[whole cultures to bits]

THAT AINT CULTURE!
anyone should be allowed to have

its as far from culture
as you can get

get it
war aint culture
any cult that sellibrates war
glorifies uncooth cultural destruction

bombing london
back to the stone age..isnt what civil cultures should be doing!

not just london

same for any other culture/city
activly collusively deceptivly sneakilly..being bombed
back into the stone age..[that only make cultural rage]

you dont civilise via
civil nor uncivil war*

but war is barbaric,
OUG,
We know, it's the religious who fight for God (God knows Why ?) and bless the soldiers & the guns who need to be told. No-one's succeeded in that yet after thousands of years.

OUG you must expect feedback with post like that!
No better day exists,than ANZAC DAY to remember why we should try to avoid war.
We do that, and we remember the sacrifice of those who did.
I can see no reason, for your post, this thread is about a shadow.
An idiot who put pen to paper saying MAYBE we should forget.
Increasingly you tilt at wind mills, that are not there!
Saw yet another post above so far from threads intended path it was strange.
I promised my self in this thread not to inflame, just protect a day that my ancestors maybe not yours, died for us.
I leave it now, out of respect for all the posts that added to the subject.
And to avoid the few that tryed to drag it down with unrelated unneeded comment.